Renaissance:Status Meetings:2009-09-21

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Meeting Details

  • 2009-09-21, 4:00 PM CET
  • IRC details:

In Attendance

  • Martin Damboldt (IRC: mdamboldt)
  • Frank Loehmann (IRC: frankl)
  • Andreas Bartel (IRC: Andreas_sun)
  • Christoph Lukasiak (IRC: clu_sun)
  • Elizabteh Matthis (IRC: lizm)
  • phaoUNTOtom
  • kunde


  • Status report
  • Round Table

Action Items

  • Deinstallation survey

Comments on Action Items

  • Deinstalltion survey: We wait until Rosana is back to get an update

Round Table

  • N/A


(3:47:10 PM) mode (+o frankl ) by ChanServ
(4:03:57 PM) lizm [n=chatzill@nat/sun/x-hquhfvxsctpnfpuq] entered the room.
(4:06:31 PM) clu_sun [n=cl114686@nat/sun/x-lflpsmtztjcdjyqe] entered the room.
(4:08:08 PM) phaoUNTOtom [n=phaoUNTO@] entered the room.
(4:09:33 PM) frankl: Hi!
(4:09:46 PM) phaoUNTOtom: Hello
(4:10:10 PM) lizm: Hi All
(4:10:55 PM) frankl: lizm: Happy Birthday Liz!
(4:11:06 PM) lizm: thx!
(4:11:53 PM) lizm: I got three boquets of flowers today, one of them from the car dealer where I picked up our Golf ;-)
(4:12:18 PM) lizm: Where is Andreas?
(4:12:42 PM) frankl: Andreas is on leave the next four weeks.
(4:12:47 PM) lizm: Already on leave?
(4:12:55 PM) frankl: Yep. I do not have that much for today's meeting, because I am right back from a four week leave and still catching up...
(4:12:57 PM) lizm: Oh yes, I forgot
(4:14:21 PM) lizm: Well, maybe phaoUNTOtom has sth for today? I only just went to Software Freedom Day on Saturday and handed out t-shirts to anyone who used OOo. I'm still recovering from the exertion---everyone seemed to be an OOo user!
(4:15:22 PM) phaoUNTOtom: :-)  Well, I'm just interested in how the look and feel of the next generation of OO.,o will be.  We use it very heavily at work.
(4:15:47 PM) phaoUNTOtom: I help out where I can with OO.o as well.  Writing, advertising, envagelizing stuff.
(4:17:20 PM) frankl: Regarding Project Renaissance we will start to take a deeper look into the Impress data of the user feedback program this week. Our goal is to identify areas in the toolbars that are not used that much. We hope to be able to reduce current UIs complexity to make it easier to transform it into a complete new UI at a later point in time.  
(4:17:28 PM) phaoUNTOtom: I do have one question but if it is appropriate, I'll wait until any agenda items are completed.
(4:17:39 PM) frankl: OK
(4:17:52 PM) lizm: I don't think we can say yet. We are still collecting feedback and testing the Renaissance prototypes
(4:19:00 PM) kunde [] entered the room.
(4:19:11 PM) lizm: Hi Kunde ;-)
(4:19:44 PM) frankl: Furthermore we want to take a deeper look on comon tasks and how to offer rich formatted document pieces (i.e. tables, color themes, designs).
(4:20:04 PM) lizm: -> Frankl do we have any specific agenda items to address now or should we ask PhaoUNTOtom to post his question now?
(4:22:33 PM) frankl: I have no more agenda items for today. Just wanted to post how we will go forward the next weeks. We will post updates on the UI list and blog about these things too.
(4:22:54 PM) frankl: Andreas and Florian Effenberger did a FAQ video about Project Renaissance. Will be published on GullFoss the next days.
(4:23:11 PM) frankl: and finally OOoCon is coming :-)
(4:24:21 PM) frankl: We will have several presentations and workshops. All this has to be prepared within the next weeks too and Andreas is on leave...
(4:24:24 PM) lizm: Orvieto in November! Go Frank! Yippee! It is going to be a very interesting conference. Everyone who can should atttend.
(4:25:32 PM) lizm: I am still hoping to post a blog on the Prototype survey responses. Should be tomorrow or Wed
(4:25:57 PM) frankl: OK cool.
(4:26:44 PM) frankl: We had a discussion with a customer here in Hamburg. Interesting feedback on latest prototypes.
(4:27:45 PM) frankl: phaoUNTOtom: What is your question?
(4:29:21 PM) phaoUNTOtom: Change is hard for most everyone.  I think the increased communication from you all is very good and important for us.  Have you seen less pushing back from us users now that there is more communication attempts or is there still a lot of concern OO.o is just copying ribbon?
(4:33:01 PM) phaoUNTOtom: Does my question make sense?
(4:33:02 PM) lizm: I feel that the lists have been relatively quiet recently and the critique that has come has often been very constructive and detailed. i.e. people really looking past the top toolbar at more of what the prototype has on offer.
(4:33:10 PM) frankl: I think the responses are calming down and are more constructive now than they were in the beginning. We started communicating about Renaissance a year ago, but never received much feedback, but this has changed now :-)
(4:33:56 PM) kunde left the room (quit: "Verlassend").
(4:34:21 PM) lizm: :-) And we aren't even sitting in the same city---- but the impression we get is the same.
(4:34:31 PM) frankl: We did loose a customer ;-)
(4:34:39 PM) phaoUNTOtom: Good.  Just as it has been said elsewhere, OO.o does have so much functionality it is hard to present it.  There does need to be some reworking of the interface.  I think we are going down the right road.
(4:34:44 PM) frankl: (kunde) in German ;-)
(4:35:23 PM) phaoUNTOtom: I was hoping the criticism wasn't detering the positive movement needed.  :-)
(4:35:30 PM) lizm: Yes, Kunde = Customer in German, he was here for the first time ever, whoever it was. Any way, what has your impression been, phaoUNTOtom?
(4:36:03 PM) phaoUNTOtom: lizm: my impression of OO.o or the project Renaissance?
(4:36:15 PM) lizm: I mean of the concern OO.o is just copying ribbon?
(4:37:51 PM) phaoUNTOtom: I don't think it is.  I see value in the ribbon even!!!!  The core of the problem is that people don't like change--though life is full of it.  If this team can focus on the base fundamentals instead of the user needs instead of playing catchup with the dominate leader, we will succeed.
(4:39:29 PM) phaoUNTOtom: Of course, I am more active in watching what happens in this area than most people. . .
(4:40:26 PM) phaoUNTOtom: . . . and I see more of the base and fundamental reasons for the change . . . but the communication you all are doing will help others
(4:40:29 PM) lizm: hey, active watchers are keen observers and so always keep us informed as to your observations of the "climate", ok?
(4:41:37 PM) lizm: What forms of communication do you think we are using best? Is it the mix that does it,( blog, lists, video, events) or is one of them particularly successful or more important?
(4:41:45 PM) frankl: I was 'warned' by a guy from Wikimedia who told me that the Project is very important for OOo, but we should not underestimate how conservative communities could be. He told this from his own experience :-)
(4:41:51 PM) ***phaoUNTOtom is an active watcher because my neck is on the line where I work.  To me, this group is doing an imporant work.  It affects what I will role out to the comptuers here.  :-)
(4:42:46 PM) lizm: Does that mean update OOo or not? Or revert to MSO 2003?
(4:43:46 PM) lizm: How long has your company been using OOo for work?
(4:44:23 PM) lizm: Ok, of course we don't need that info in a public chat, just getting a bit ahead of myself. Don't answer if necessary. ;-)
(4:45:12 PM) phaoUNTOtom: lizm: Good question.  I don't know the answer.  At first I might say where you receive the worst comments; but, alas, people just don't read and sometimes have an agenda and don't care what others say.  Maybe I would say as you go through this project, occassionally ask yourself what would make the best positive communication impact and go with that path.  Realizing that path may change from month to month as it is not always the same.
(4:48:04 PM) frankl: lizm: I had a look on the meeting minutes from last week. Are there any new regarding the deinstallation survey for OOo 3.2?
(4:49:30 PM) lizm: Yes, Rosana finished it and had it implemented in 3.2. But the German translation wasn't in Lime Survey yet. I suggested she do a rough translation. She asked Andreas to correct her translattion. Not sure if he did it before leaving.
(4:51:05 PM) frankl: OK, I will ask her. English version is most important to get some more information about why people leave OOo.
(4:51:17 PM) phaoUNTOtom: We changed to using OO.o because of cost savings and because it worked quite well for us.  The users have been using it for almost 4 years.  I am getting ready to roll out OO.o 3.1.1 with survey gathering information turned on.
(4:53:05 PM) phaoUNTOtom: In our mind, the purpose of any office suite is to communicate with others through the limitations of the computer.  If you can make it easier for us to do so through this project, then horray!!
(4:53:07 PM) lizm: excellent
(4:53:23 PM) frankl: The user OOo Feedback Program turned on? That's good real user input. Thanks for that!
(4:54:13 PM) frankl: Anything else for today?
(4:55:03 PM) lizm: Not from me. Except to say thx to phaoUNTOtom for the good discussion and input.
(4:55:19 PM) phaoUNTOtom: Sure, it is a win-win situation for us.
(4:55:33 PM) frankl: So see you next week. Bye Frank.
(4:55:44 PM) phaoUNTOtom: Good bye.
(4:55:49 PM) phaoUNTOtom left the room (quit: Remote closed the connection).
(4:55:57 PM) lizm: bye
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