Log Mac Meeting 18 May 2007
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[22:01] <CerebrosuS> 22 h -Berlin Time-
[22:01] <CerebrosuS> *smile*
[22:01] <paveljanik> ;-)
[22:02] <CerebrosuS> So i will start
[22:02] <CerebrosuS> i
[22:02] <CerebrosuS> i'm cerebrosus
[22:02] <CerebrosuS> can call me christian
[22:02] * Bi-noix has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
[22:03] <CerebrosuS> i'm a new developer and will try to support your ooo port to mac
[22:03] <CerebrosuS> at time i'm learning about the structure of vcl and how i works
[22:04] <CerebrosuS> so that's all this time, ... from my point
[22:04] <paveljanik> CerebrosuS: thanks and welcome :-)
[22:04] <CerebrosuS> thx
[22:05] <paveljanik> other developers?
[22:05] <paveljanik> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_Port_Meetings#Next_Meeting
[22:06] <paveljanik> shaunmcdonald: ping?
[22:06] <CerebrosuS> and we learn from the ccc : just judge someone from the action he does and not from his look religion and nationality
[22:06] <ybart> CerebrosuS: welcome
[22:06] <paveljanik> ericb2: ping?
[22:06] <CerebrosuS> so no comment about that lol
[22:07] <CerebrosuS> thx ybart
[22:08] <ismael_> ChanServ:
[22:08] <ismael_> che
[22:08] <ismael_> CerebrosuS: welcome
[22:08] <CerebrosuS> thx
[22:08] <ismael_> (sorry for the completion problems)
[22:09] <ericb2> good evening
[22:09] <ericb2> sorry, I was doing other things :)
[22:10] <CerebrosuS> np
[22:11] <ericb2> CerebrosuS: have you Carbon / C++ knowledge ?
[22:12] <CerebrosuS> ;) no carbonat this, just learning about that, but qt, gtk, mfc and other interfaces so i hope it will be fast to get the knowledge
[22:12] <CerebrosuS> but c++ and ooo for round 9 years
[22:13] <ericb2> CerebrosuS: sure you will be fast
[22:13] <paveljanik> CerebrosuS: OOo for ~9 years? ;-)
[22:13] <CerebrosuS> java too, ... but i thought it won't be such important
[22:13] <CerebrosuS> oh sry
[22:13] <CerebrosuS> oop
[22:13] <CerebrosuS> lol
[22:13] <paveljanik> ;-)
[22:14] <ericb2> CerebrosuS: you'll be our Java guru ;)
[22:14] <CerebrosuS> o0
[22:14] <CerebrosuS> no one could prog in java?
[22:15] <ericb2> CerebrosuS: several Sunnies are able to prog in Java on the channel I guess ;)
[22:15] <CerebrosuS> ok hehe
[22:16] <CerebrosuS> it the best joice for oop so everyone should learn it ;)
[22:16] <ericb2> Other devs want to present themselves ?
[22:18] <CerebrosuS> no one? not so much
[22:19] <ericb2> Ok, Next point ?
[22:19] <CerebrosuS> last aqua new / work in progress
[22:20] * CerebrosuS is listening
[22:20] * ericb2 updated the changelog : http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/User:Ericb#Changelog
[22:21] <ericb2> With all the last progress we did, I declared Alpha 0.9 started
[22:21] <CerebrosuS> ok
[22:21] <ericb2> Current status of Top 10 of issues is : http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/User:Ericb/Top10_of_Issues
[22:22] <ericb2> for issue 73688 , I think Herbert fixed it
[22:22] <IZBot> porting DEFECT NEW aquavcl01->use default system font instead of helvetica in aqua http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi? id=73688
[22:22] <mav_eric> looks impressive.
[22:22] <ericb2> he will confirm
[22:22] <CerebrosuS> sure
[22:23] <mav_eric> and we did a lot of progress since announcing top ten
[22:23] <ericb2> paveljanik: no recent Aqua news ?
[22:23] <ericb2> ismael_: ?
[22:24] <ismael_> ericb2: i haven't done a lot of things these last days
[22:24] <ismael_> ericb2: i read documentation about HIViews and HIobject for my GSOC
[22:25] <ismael_> i started coding a bit salnativewidget.cxx
[22:25] <mav_eric> ericb2: what about your latest patch that starts and helps us solves some important refreshing issues
[22:25] <paveljanik> no, IIRC not that I remember ;-)
[22:25] <ericb2> issue 77450
[22:25] <IZBot> porting DEFECT RESOLVED FIXED Add Aqua theme for Toolbars http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=77450
[22:26] <ericb2> now toolbars use Aqua theme
[22:26] <ericb2> issue 77451
[22:26] <IZBot> porting DEFECT NEW Add Aqua theme for Tooltips ( Apple name : " help tags") http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=77451
[22:26] <ericb2> I have tried to add tooltips, but I'm not arrived
[22:27] <ericb2> paveljanik: what about commit http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/patches/salnativewidgets/may_2007/tooltips/ aqua_tooltips_first_try.diff
[22:27] <ericb2> paveljanik: after clean up ( remove delay too )
[22:30] <ericb2> Lastly, I have found something - IMHO - very interesting for the refresh
[22:30] <ericb2> See : http://porting.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=mac&msgNo=5361
[22:32] <CerebrosuS> did i understand ist right that the sal classes is the interface between the port and application?
[22:32] <CerebrosuS> -s
[22:32] <CerebrosuS> s/is/are/
[22:32] <CerebrosuS> hmpf
[22:33] <ericb2> did somebody test my code ?
[22:33] <mav_eric> ericb2: yes. I played a bit with the OOo that contained your code and I was able to really use the aqua version for the first time
[22:34] <ericb2> mav_eric: good :)
[22:34] <mav_eric> ericb2: I experienced no crashes while doing some smal editings on my application etc
[22:34] <paveljanik> ericb2: yup, I'll have a look at all patches hopefully during weekend.
[22:34] <mav_eric> ericb2: in general Aqua OOo is much more stable now then it was back when I tested it the last - that was m208 I think
[22:34] <ericb2> paveljanik: thanks :)
[22:34] <ybart> ericb2: However, we have crashes in applications such as Base...
[22:35] <ybart> ericb2: But it's not related to your specific changes IMHO
[22:35] <ericb2> ybart I didn't test Base.
[22:35] <mav_eric> ybart: that's right. But I only worked with Writer and opened a spreadshet and an presentation
[22:35] <ericb2> ybart I know Impress has a problem with Text (not diplayed)
[22:35] <ybart> ericb2: We should have a look there sooner or later...
[22:35] <mav_eric> ybart: I didn't try base
[22:36] <ericb2> ybart refresh, fonts and missing methods/functions first
[22:36] <ybart> ericb2: Of course
[22:36] <paveljanik> BTW - I have added aqua builds to my regular uploads, because many people here in CZ asked me for them.
[22:37] <ericb2> mikesic wanted to propose something for the missing methods
[22:37] <paveljanik> http://ftp.linux.cz/pub/localization/OpenOffice.org/devel/AQUA/SRC680_m211/Build-1/
[22:37] <ericb2> paveljanik: means we start to provide pre-alpha ?
[22:37] <paveljanik> if we want to ;-)
[22:38] <ybart> Yaeah ! Great news...
[22:38] <paveljanik> better not hide where we are...
[22:38] <mav_eric> maybe we should start versioning with 0.0.1 ;-)
[22:38] <ybart> :-P
[22:38] <ericb2> paveljanik: I think we can just provide pre-alpha, without announce them
[22:38] <mav_eric> ericb2: they will get discovered sooner or later
[22:38] <ismael_> ericb2: and announce when we'll have an alpha
[22:39] <mav_eric> what won't be that far into future since we're already at alpha 0.9
[22:39] <ybart> I think it's a good idea to tell the world...
[22:39] * ericb2 provides experimental versions at http://ftp.cusoo.org/MacOSX/INTEL/native_10.4.4/
[22:39] <ericb2> ismael_: exactly
[22:39] <CerebrosuS> guys i'm sry, i have to go, ... i will watch the TODO Task tomorrow, ... so have a nice evening
[22:39] * ericb2 afraid by the bandwidth
[22:39] <CerebrosuS> cu tomorrow
[22:39] <ericb2> CerebrosuS: cu
[22:40] <mav_eric> CerebrosuS: good night
[22:40] <ismael_> mav_eric: yes, but only by concerned people, not by everybody and especially people who don't understant it is a pre-alpha
[22:40] <ybart> CerebrosuS: see you
[22:40] * CerebrosuS is now known as cere_notAv
[22:40] <ybart> ericb2: bandwodth problem => buzz !
[22:40] <mav_eric> ismael_: you're right but I think we can communicate it the right way even to end users
[22:40] <paveljanik> ftp.linux.cz doesn't have bandwidth problems 8)
[22:41] <ismael_> mav_eric: i don't know what is the best
[22:41] <mav_eric> ismael_: being honest? :-)
[22:41] <ericb2> ybart the server hosting my build is strong enough, but Mac users are .. hmm
[22:41] <ybart> IMHO sooner or later doesn't really matters
[22:41] <ismael_> mav_eric: ;-)
[22:42] * ericb2 is proud to see were we are now
[22:42] <ybart> ericb2: I know but should you provide alpha or pre-alpha, the result will the almost the same :-)
[22:42] <ericb2> ybart sure
[22:42] <mav_eric> the only problem I see is the version number
[22:42] <paveljanik> this is the development snapshot, not alpha.
[22:42] <ybart> ericb2: You will have both happy and unhappy users
[22:42] <mav_eric> 2.3.0 sounds like we have an already full working aqua version
[22:42] <ericb2> ybart as usual :)
[22:42] <ericb2> mav_eric: no, fonts issues, refresh issues
[22:43] <ericb2> mav_eric: once fixed, ok
[22:43] <mav_eric> ericb2: I know but the version number implicates that
[22:43] <ybart> ericb2: mav_eric said about version numbering
[22:43] <ybart> mav_eric: You're true, maybe we should use another versioning scheme until beta
[22:43] <ericb2> other news about code
[22:43] <mav_eric> ericb2: in open-source it is kind of common to release an alpha being 0.1 or something and not 2.1
[22:44] <mav_eric> or 2.3
[22:44] <ericb2> mav_eric: I wrote alpha 0.9 is ork in progress in my wiki page ;)
[22:44] <ericb2> work in progress, sorry
[22:44] * shaunmcdonald has just woke up from nap
[22:44] <ybart> May be a good versioning scheme will be to just provide the build date
[22:44] <mav_eric> ericb2: that's O.K. but the dmg has 2.3.0
[22:44] * GlowingApple (n=jayson@pc237522758324.unl.edu) has joined #ooo_macport
[22:46] <paveljanik> mav_eric: the same as other development snapshots produced by me...
[22:47] <mav_eric> paveljanik: hmm. So users know that this is an development snaphost
[22:47] <mav_eric> if that's the case it's o.k. with me
[22:47] <ericb2> mav_eric: I think, until we announce alpha version, this is pre alpha, no ?
[22:47] <mav_eric> ericb2: you're right
[22:47] <ericb2> for me no problem at all
[22:47] <ericb2> again about code
[22:48] <shaunmcdonald> Currently all mac builds are built with the same .app name in the .dmg
[22:48] <ericb2> I started clipping
[22:48] <paveljanik> no, there is no pre alpha.
[22:48] <paveljanik> This is regular development snapshot.
[22:48] <shaunmcdonald> it might be an idea to have openoffice.org 2 aqua.app
[22:48] <ericb2> and I'm testing something very close to clipping implemented in salgdi
[22:48] <paveljanik> there will be regular development snapshots after alpha, after beta and even after release.
[22:49] <shaunmcdonald> to be able to tell the deifference between the aqua and X11 builds
[22:49] <shaunmcdonald> the .dmg will itself will need to be renamed likewise
[22:49] <GlowingApple> hi everyone. For the aqua build, is there an easy way to update the source and build with the newest patches? I'm guessing I shoudl not run a cvs up as the OOo code is using a set milestone
[22:49] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: dum^^mac user s wont ask for X11 ?
[22:50] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: we need an easy way to tell the difference between the X11 apps and the aqua apps
[22:51] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: I introduced one recently ; preferences are not in the same folder
[22:51] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: and we can continue using a new name for the bundle
[22:52] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: I propose to name the X11 ones with X11 in the name, and the aqua one with nothing more (implies it is the regular version)
[22:52] <paveljanik> ybart: +1. so the change should be done *outsied* auqavcl01...
[22:52] <ericb2> paveljanik: in obr5 ?
[22:52] <shaunmcdonald> ybart: we would need to wait until 2.3 we can rename X11
[22:53] <ybart> paveljanik, shaunmcdonald: no problem
[22:53] <ericb2> paveljanik: oliver and me have to create a cws for bundle changes ( remove program )
[22:53] <paveljanik> ericb2: outside auqavcl01. Maybe in obr5.
[22:53] <shaunmcdonald> we would need to wait until after then before releasing aqua builds with no aqua in the name
[22:53] <ybart> paveljanik, shaunmcdonald: no problem
[22:53] <ericb2> paveljanik: oliver and me have to create a cws for bundle changes ( remove program )
[22:53] <paveljanik> ericb2: outside auqavcl01. Maybe in obr5.
[22:53] <shaunmcdonald> we would need to wait until after then before releasing aqua builds with no aqua in the name
[22:54] <shaunmcdonald> the idea is that someone who download one of our alpha aqua builds won't over write their current X11 installation
[22:54] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: this is already the case
[22:54] <shaunmcdonald> that is the reason why I bring up the .app rename
[22:55] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: I guess it will be installed somewhere else, no ?
[22:55] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: We can add -dev in the app name ?
[22:56] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: I suppose it is currently "OpenOffice.org 2.3.app", whereas the current stable release is "OpenOffice.org 2.2.app"
[22:56] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: indeed
[22:56] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: So, nothing will be overwritten...
[22:56] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: and people installing 2.3.0 know what they are doing
[22:57] <shaunmcdonald> ybart: until ooo 2.3 comes out ;-)
[22:57] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: Of course :-)
[22:57] <shaunmcdonald> so are we going to do the renaming of the X11 version for 2.3?
[22:57] <ybart> ericb2: The one installing the dev version ? Not sure...
[22:57] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: Rename the dmg but not the app IMHO
[22:58] <shaunmcdonald> ybart: from 2.3 if they are using 2.3 X11, then the .app name would be "OpenOffice.org 2-X11.app"
[22:59] <ericb2> another good news, is Yvan alias ybart provided the first printing window : 
[22:59] <shaunmcdonald> if they are installing the aqua version it would be "OpenOffice.org 2.app"
[22:59] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: Ok for me
[22:59] <shaunmcdonald> that would be my proposal
[22:59] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: But with a space instead of -
[23:00] <ybart> (just a detail)
[23:00] * ericb2 vote for shaunmcdonald proposal
[23:00] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: +1
[23:00] <shaunmcdonald> there needs to be work for the .DS_Store for 2.3 X11 any way
[23:00] * ybart too
[23:01] <shaunmcdonald> so for the Aqua alpha, which will be be release before OpenOffice.org 2.3, we will use the .app name of "OpenOffice.org 2.3.app" ?
[23:01] <mav_eric> ybart: the - is suits better for Unix enviroments and we're currently using it
[23:02] <ybart> mav_eric: .app is not part of common Unix environment
[23:02] <shaunmcdonald> it doesn't really matter whether there is a - or a space that is a minor detail, I don't mind either
[23:02] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: I agree too
[23:02] <mav_eric> ybart: sure but for the testtool app
[23:03] <paveljanik> next point? ;-)
[23:03] <shaunmcdonald> ybart: the .app needs to be there, but is hidden on the mac
[23:03] <ybart> mav_eric: It was a user-oriented POV...
[23:03] <mav_eric> the testtool app doesn't like spaces - we had this trouble once. Aks jamesmckenzie
[23:03] <paveljanik> the naming is so minor issue now...
[23:03] <ericb2> Next Point : 3. WWDC 2007 (weekly news)
[23:03] <mav_eric> paveljanik: agreed. Let's continue
[23:04] <ericb2> FYI, I have tried to invite Philipp Lohmann at WWDC
[23:04] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: It's not why I intended to say. I just point the fact that bundles are not common in Unix
[23:04] <shaunmcdonald> mav_eric: that error with space has been fixed some time ago
[23:04] <ericb2> can we continue ?
[23:04] <mav_eric> yes we can
[23:04] <shaunmcdonald> ybart: ok, lets continue with the next point
[23:04] <ericb2> I did an official demand to Philipp hierarchy
[23:04] <ericb2> and I'm waiting
[23:05] <ericb2> the eTicket is ok (from Apple )
[23:05] <ybart> shaunmcdonald: To answer your question about aqua naming, I prefer appending -dev to the version number if we release it to public
[23:05] <ericb2> but i want to be sure we have enough money to pay the travel + hotel
[23:06] <ericb2> currently, Team e.V nor Apple (afaik) sent the money to cusoon
[23:06] <ericb2> and we have not enough, so we must wait
[23:06] <ericb2> I hope the situation will progress asap
[23:07] <ericb2> again, I invite people to propose questions, and code, or whatever , using http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/ User:Ericb#Mac_OS_X_porter_Team_at_WWDC_2007
[23:09] <ericb2> Next point ?
[23:09] <ericb2> 4. Prepare OOoCon 2007 ( deadline : 1st June for proposal ! )
[23:10] <ismael_> i may not be able to attend as i start school the same week, so i won't propose a talk
[23:11] <ericb2> ismael_: can't you delay ? Nothing important happens the first week ;)
[23:11] <ericb2> ismael_: could be a good occasion to present yourself to a lot of people. This is important too ^^
[23:12] <ismael_> ericb2: as i'm not sure if i will be able to attend or not, i prefer not to do a talk, but i will try to come
[23:13] <ericb2> ismael_: this is damage. I'm sure you'd have proposed a great conf :-/
[23:13] <ismael_> ericb2: next year
[23:14] <ericb2> ismael_: another information : your expenses for the travel can be funded if you do a conf
[23:14] <ericb2> ismael_: but I'll respect your choice
[23:15] <shaunmcdonald> Unless something comes up I'll be going to ooocon2007, and will be happy to be a speaker if I can come up with something to speak about
[23:15] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: you have a lot to say : bots, the website, the port ... your contributions ( cws ..etc)
[23:16] <ybart> Will it be recorded ?
[23:16] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: I have only done 1 CWS so far
[23:16] <shaunmcdonald> ybart: hopefully the same as last year
[23:16] <ybart> :-)
[23:16] <shaunmcdonald> where there was a video taken and the presentation files put online
[23:16] <ismael_> ericb2: i will try to have more informations concerning the start of school year
[23:17] <mikesic> If travel could be paid, I would propose to talk about debugging with Emacs and gdb, or XCode
[23:17] <ybart> If you want, I would be happy to review your Impress docs...
[23:17] <ericb2> ismael_: yes, please
[23:17] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: I think what I need is for someone to just give me a narrow focused topic and a few bullet points to work on
[23:17] <ericb2> mikesic: you can ask. I'd be glad to meet you for true !
[23:18] <mikesic> ericb2: I would like to meet everyone as well :)
[23:18] <ericb2> mikesic: I know the amount of money is limited, but it could be possible
[23:18] <paveljanik> mikesic: IIRC, we never had enough money to cover the expenses for travels...
[23:18] <paveljanik> it always depends on the local organizers.
[23:19] <mikesic> paveljanik: I didn't think travel would be paid, and I can't afford the trip myself this year :(
[23:19] <ericb2> paveljanik: if I'm not too wrong, there is some residual money from Lyon confs
[23:20] <ericb2> mikesic: I'll ask. I'm tired we never have enough money for the minimum
[23:20] * paveljanik hopes at least half of that sum was returned for meal ;-)
[23:20] <mikesic> ericb2: Thanks :)
[23:21] <ericb2> mikesic: you are welcome
[23:21] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: the Paris Expo is going to be before the ooocon2007 this year
[23:21] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: I have not the dates in mind . Do you know them ?
[23:22] <paveljanik> next point?
[23:22] <shaunmcdonald> 25 to 29 September
[23:22] <shaunmcdonald> according to http://www.apple-expo.com/uk/index.php?home=gp
[23:22] <ericb2> Next point is :
[23:22] <ericb2> 5. TODO tasks in Issues - to better know what needs doing and who is doing what
[23:22] <paveljanik> Good. I hope we will always use this URL for our TODO/list of issues: http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/buglist.cgi?keywords=aqua
[23:22] <ericb2> URL : http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/AquaToDo#Other_known_issues
[23:23] <shaunmcdonald> oocon2007 is 19-21 september, so expo is after ooocon2007 again
[23:23] <paveljanik> This is another URL ;-)
[23:23] <shaunmcdonald> this time not overlapping with ooocon
[23:24] <ericb2> paveljanik: I suggest we create aqua issues, and once created, we remove the job from the list
[23:24] <ericb2> (in Other_known_issues )
[23:24] <paveljanik> good idea. And then remove that page completely.
[23:24] <ericb2> paveljanik: automagically :)
[23:24] <paveljanik> because it again is a duplicate of the other source of infos. Like your changelog.
[23:25] <ericb2> paveljanik: my changelog, is personal
[23:25] <ericb2> paveljanik: just as reminder
[23:26] <ericb2> in my eternal draft in progress :)
[23:27] <ericb2> as conclusion for this point, I invite all people willing to write code, to :
[23:27] <ericb2> 1) create corresponding issue, assign the issue to them, and add aqua as keyword
[23:27] <ericb2> 2) remove the job from the list in http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_Port_Meetings#Next_Meeting wiki page
[23:28] * dave_largo has quit ("Client exiting")
[23:28] <ericb2> 3) invite to test on mac@porting when patch ..etc somethig is fixed or has to be tested
[23:28] <ericb2> Questions ?
[23:28] <mikesic> ericb2: But that doesn't due for issues no one is ready to work on?
[23:29] <mikesic> I would propose
[23:29] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: are you sure you have the right link?
[23:29] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: sorry :)
[23:29] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: shouldn't it be http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/AquaToDo#Other_known_issues
[23:29] <mikesic> to put all in myself, and then when you start work,
[23:29] <mikesic> take ownership and change status to started
[23:30] <ericb2> mikesic: the drawback is for remaining issues, better one link only
[23:30] <paveljanik> mikesic: +1
[23:30] <mikesic> I agree one link - as pavel proposed - in the issues
[23:30] <ericb2> mikesic: I'd prefer more progressive way
[23:31] <ericb2> mikesic: create issue for people willing to solve them, and keep the list of unassignd in one piece only
[23:31] <paveljanik> no, every task should be one IZ issue.
[23:31] <mikesic> ericb2: how will this work once alpha is released?
[23:32] <ericb2> mikesic: we simply continue until all tasks are done
[23:32] <paveljanik> so we have up to date informations available somewhere without the burden of wiki page management. wiki doesn't work for us, we only duplicate infos and do not maintain them...
[23:33] <ericb2> paveljanik: for newcomers, IZ is a nightmare
[23:33] <paveljanik> is it?
[23:33] <mikesic> ericb2: Is the wiki better?
[23:34] <mav_eric> paveljanik: sort of - but they get used to it
[23:34] <paveljanik> is http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/buglist.cgi?keywords=aqua nightmare???
[23:34] <mikesic> ericb2: How does a newbie find the right page?
[23:34] <ericb2> mikesic: this is complementary
[23:34] <ericb2> paveljanik: lol
[23:34] <mav_eric> paveljanik: even older members on german mailinglists are shy about using IZ and tell it to every newbie willing to hear it
[23:34] <ericb2> paveljanik: no, IZ use. Not so easy for beginners
[23:34] <ericb2> paveljanik: do you remember Kazunari Hirano presentation in Berlin ?
[23:35] <paveljanik> ericb2: so we will duplicate info from IZ to wiki and keep old, not updated info in wiki?
[23:35] <paveljanik> no
[23:35] <ericb2> paveljanik: no, remove progressively duplicated infos
[23:35] <ericb2> paveljanik: I agree all issues must go in IZ
[23:36] <paveljanik> can the progress be done in ~1 day?
[23:36] <ericb2> paveljanik: you mean create all issues ?
[23:36] <paveljanik> so the duplicate page can be removed immediately?
[23:36] <paveljanik> yes.
[23:36] <paveljanik> all are tasks.
[23:36] <paveljanik> tasks must be in IZ.
[23:36] <ericb2> paveljanik: whom will be assigned the issues ?
[23:36] <paveljanik> if it is not the task, it is a wish -> ENHANCEMENT/FEATURE.
[23:36] <paveljanik> ericb2: doesn't matter. Create devnull account for it.
[23:37] <paveljanik> I do not care as long as it has aqua keyword.
[23:37] <ericb2> paveljanik: ok
[23:37] <ericb2> who disagrees ?
[23:37] <mikesic> ericb2: I don't think assigned to is required
[23:37] <ericb2> who is volunteer to create all issues, means one per task ?
[23:38] <mikesic> ericb2: Leave it blank until work is started
[23:38] <ericb2> mikesic: I'm default owner, and I have too much issues arelady assigned to me
[23:38] <mikesic> ericb2: I already vlunteered
[23:38] <paveljanik> mikesic: Assigned to: has default value.
[23:38] <paveljanik> mikesic: thanks.
[23:38] <paveljanik> +1
[23:38] <shaunmcdonald> there was some talk some time ago to make a dummy mac account where all mac issues are auto assigned on creation, instead of them being assigned to ericb2 by default
[23:38] <mikesic> ericb2: when yo awake - it will be done
[23:38] <ericb2> mikesic: good. Go ahead !
[23:38] <paveljanik> ;-)
[23:38] * malcom555 (n=rekot@adsl-ull-141-217.42-151.net24.it) has joined #ooo_macport
[23:38] <paveljanik> I like this "progressive" progress ;-)
[23:38] <ericb2> Next point ?
[23:38] * malcom555 (n=rekot@adsl-ull-141-217.42-151.net24.it) has left #ooo_macport
[23:39] <paveljanik> This is the enw principle for us: not duplicate, properly maintain the source...
[23:40] * shaunmcdonald thinks it would be nice to be able to tell the difference between issues assigned to ericb2 and those assigned to him being the default owner of Mac OS X issues
[23:40] <paveljanik> shaunmcdonald: STARTED?
[23:40] <mikesic> shaunmcdonald: I will make a special user
[23:41] <shaunmcdonald> paveljanik: yeah I suppose
[23:41] * mikesic mac?
[23:41] <shaunmcdonald> mikesic: that would be a better option
[23:41] <mikesic> or aqua?
[23:41] <shaunmcdonald> or macissues
[23:41] <paveljanik> macport?
[23:42] <shaunmcdonald> aqua -1
[23:42] <shaunmcdonald> macport +1
[23:42] <mikesic> macport +1
[23:42] <ericb2> macport is good +1
[23:42] * ericb2 will create macport user
[23:42] <mikesic> ericb2: great
[23:43] <ericb2> mikesic: please assign the issues to macport
[23:43] <paveljanik> AI: ericb2 to create macport user
[23:43] <mikesic> ericb2: will do
[23:43] <ericb2> mikesic: just wait this user does exist ;)
[23:43] <shaunmcdonald> where will mail go for that user?
[23:43] <paveljanik> AI: ericb2 to change the default assignee to macport
[23:43] <paveljanik> AI: ericb2 announce it on dev@porting
[23:43] * shaunmcdonald thinks a special list for issues assigned to that user would be appropriate
[23:44] <shaunmcdonald> mac@porting isn't appropriate
[23:44] <ericb2> paveljanik: I'll first create the user
[23:44] <paveljanik> AI: ericb2 move all his issues got by default assignee to user macport
[23:44] <paveljanik> ok?
[23:44] <ericb2> paveljanik: agreed
[23:44] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: please also send an announcement to mac@porting of the change
[23:44] * shaunmcdonald isn't on dev@porting any more
[23:44] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: I'll do + CC to dev@porting
[23:45] <paveljanik> AI: mikesic enter issues from the page listed above as issues assigned to macport and delete that page with unmaintained issues.
[23:45] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: :-)
[23:45] <paveljanik> good.
[23:45] <mikesic> :)
[23:45] <paveljanik> do we have any similar page with unmaintained informations?
[23:46] <paveljanik> IIRC we had at least 4 such todo lists...
[23:47] * shaunmcdonald thinks the wiki rarely gets updated for todo lists
[23:48] <ismael_> good night
[23:48] * ismael_ has quit ()
[23:48] <paveljanik> so: we have http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_Porting_-_Work_Areas/Todo%27s
[23:48] <paveljanik> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Wish_list_for_Mac_OS_X_port
[23:48] <paveljanik> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/AquaToDo
[23:49] <paveljanik> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Aquavcl01_tasks
[23:49] <paveljanik> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/List_of_OpenOffice.org_Mac_OS_X_issues_and_problems
[23:49] <paveljanik> TERRIBLE...
[23:49] <ericb2> paveljanik: you exagerate
[23:49] <paveljanik> ericb2: me? ;-)
[23:49] * GlowingApple_ (n=jayson@udp016753uds.unl.edu) has joined #ooo_macport
[23:49] <ericb2> paveljanik: you :)
[23:49] <paveljanik> aren't these all TODO lists?
[23:49] <ericb2> paveljanik: not exactly
[23:50] <paveljanik> unmaintained TODO lists?
[23:50] <ericb2> paveljanik: not all :)
[23:50] * paveljanik thinks mikesic will now realize he shouldn't volunteer ;-)
[23:51] <paveljanik> ericb2: so we have more of them???
[23:51] <ericb2> paveljanik: some are todo lists, some are drafts
[23:51] <paveljanik> drafts of todo lists?
[23:51] <ericb2> paveljanik: e.g. one does contain logs
[23:52] <ericb2> paveljanik: not the same as enumerate tasks
[23:52] <mikesic> paveljanik: Can I enter everything and then we mark what's duplicate as invalid?
[23:52] <paveljanik> mikesic: yes.
[23:53] <paveljanik> ericb2: I wish to have native spell checker (this is a wish, so it will be at Wish_list_for_Mac_OS_X_port). There is a task to implement native spell checker (Aquavcl01_tasks). As such it is on our TODO (AquaToDo). And finally, it is also an issue in IssueZilla.
[23:53] <paveljanik> Great...
[23:54] <paveljanik> do you see the absurdity in this?
[23:55] <cloph_away> shaunmcdonald: wrt. the macport-user: You don't need a mailing list. You can "watch" other users in IssueZilla, you can add users to your list of watched accounts and then you'll recieve every IZmail, just like the user does. - a mailinglist for this would be overkill.
[23:56] * ericb2 created macport@openoffice.org
[23:56] <ericb2> user
[23:56] <shaunmcdonald> cloph_away: so many people can listen to the same user?
[23:56] * cloph_away is now known as cloph
[23:56] <cloph> shaunmcdonald: exactly.
[23:57] <shaunmcdonald> you might like this link then http://porting.openoffice.org/issues/userprefs.cgi?bank=diffs
[23:57] <cloph> Edit prefs email-settings Users to watch
[23:58] <shaunmcdonald> cloph: I've edited my prefs, the above link takes you straight there
[00:00] <ericb2> @all : the new user name is macport
[00:02] * mikesic I have to go now for dinner - I be back later - data entry :)
[00:03] * GlowingApple has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
[00:04] <ericb2> Next meeting : Friday 26 May / same hour ?
[00:04] * mikesic has quit ()
[00:05] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: +1
[00:05] <ericb2> shaunmcdonald: ahh I'm not alone :)
[00:05] <mav_eric> ericb2: +1
[00:07] <ericb2> cloph: how many time is needed before I can invite an user in porting project ?
[00:07] <cloph> ?
[00:07] <shaunmcdonald> ericb2: ?
[00:07] <ericb2> cloph: I created macport , probably in www project or something
[00:07] * cloph doesn't understand the question..
[00:07] <ericb2> cloph: I created a login
[00:08] <ericb2> cloph: with my email adress, to filter
[00:08] <ericb2> cloph: and have a copy
[00:08] <ericb2> cloph: now, this user does not appear in portig project
[00:08] <ericb2> cloph: so I have tried to invite him
[00:08] <cloph> Just log in as that user and click "request member role", then log in as your real account and confirm the requrest.
[00:08] <cloph> Or login with your real account and enter the login manually.
[00:09] <cloph> ericb2: Make sure to (force) reload the pages
[00:09] <ericb2> cloph: I'll request member role
[00:09] <ericb2> cloph: ok
[00:11] <ericb2> cloph: works fine, thanks
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