Difference between revisions of "Log Mac Meeting 4 July 2007"
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[14:09] shaunmcdonald 2. Latest Aqua news / Work in progress | [14:09] shaunmcdonald 2. Latest Aqua news / Work in progress | ||
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[14:09] hdu_hh handling AppleEvents | [14:09] hdu_hh handling AppleEvents | ||
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[14:10] PhilippL aquavcl01 is ready for nomination. | [14:10] PhilippL aquavcl01 is ready for nomination. | ||
+ | |||
[14:10] shaunmcdonald The 2nd preview release has been out in the wild for a couple of days now | [14:10] shaunmcdonald The 2nd preview release has been out in the wild for a couple of days now | ||
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[14:11] shaunmcdonald there has been a few useful issues | [14:11] shaunmcdonald there has been a few useful issues | ||
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[14:11] CerebrosuS getKeyName implementation in AquaSalFrame | [14:11] CerebrosuS getKeyName implementation in AquaSalFrame | ||
+ | |||
[14:11] shaunmcdonald not much in terms of other publicity yet | [14:11] shaunmcdonald not much in terms of other publicity yet | ||
+ | |||
[14:11] hdu_hh there seems to be much less public interest in the 2nd preview. Why? This is usable for many tasks now while the old release wasn't | [14:11] hdu_hh there seems to be much less public interest in the 2nd preview. Why? This is usable for many tasks now while the old release wasn't | ||
+ | |||
[14:12] shaunmcdonald It doesn't seem to have gone into the versiontracker mail | [14:12] shaunmcdonald It doesn't seem to have gone into the versiontracker mail | ||
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[14:12] PhilippL hdu_hh: sic transit gloria mundi ... | [14:12] PhilippL hdu_hh: sic transit gloria mundi ... | ||
+ | |||
[14:12] shaunmcdonald the X11 version got there though | [14:12] shaunmcdonald the X11 version got there though | ||
+ | |||
[14:13] shaunmcdonald 1,899 referals from versiontracker for the X11 | [14:13] shaunmcdonald 1,899 referals from versiontracker for the X11 | ||
+ | |||
[14:13] shaunmcdonald version of ooo 2.2.1 | [14:13] shaunmcdonald version of ooo 2.2.1 | ||
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[14:15] sunrayjogi ExLachs: no | [14:15] sunrayjogi ExLachs: no | ||
− | [14:15] shaunmcdonald now that aqua 2nd preview has been out for a few days and initial distribution problems are sorted, we should start speaking to some media | + | |
+ | [14:15] shaunmcdonald now that aqua 2nd preview has been out for a few days and initial distribution problems are sorted, we should start speaking to | ||
+ | some media | ||
+ | |||
[14:16] PhilippL media ? | [14:16] PhilippL media ? | ||
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[14:16] shaunmcdonald we have had 464 referalls from version tracker for the current aqua version | [14:16] shaunmcdonald we have had 464 referalls from version tracker for the current aqua version | ||
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[14:16] * ericb2 back | [14:16] * ericb2 back | ||
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[14:16] ericb2 sorry , very busy today | [14:16] ericb2 sorry , very busy today | ||
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[14:16] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: mac news sites | [14:16] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: mac news sites | ||
+ | |||
[14:17] shaunmcdonald ericb2: no problem, we're now at item 2 of the agenda | [14:17] shaunmcdonald ericb2: no problem, we're now at item 2 of the agenda | ||
+ | |||
[14:17] shaunmcdonald http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/32607 is the aqua version of ooo | [14:17] shaunmcdonald http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/32607 is the aqua version of ooo | ||
+ | |||
[14:17] * shaunmcdonald thinks we should upload an icon for it | [14:17] * shaunmcdonald thinks we should upload an icon for it | ||
+ | |||
[14:18] shaunmcdonald a 32x32 picel 24 bit png icon is needed | [14:18] shaunmcdonald a 32x32 picel 24 bit png icon is needed | ||
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[14:20] * CerebrosuS could create one, ... from an ooo icon, ... but where or how to upload it? | [14:20] * CerebrosuS could create one, ... from an ooo icon, ... but where or how to upload it? | ||
+ | |||
[14:20] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: I have developer access to the ooo products in VersionTracker | [14:20] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: I have developer access to the ooo products in VersionTracker | ||
+ | |||
[14:21] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: thus I have the form sitting here as part of my account | [14:21] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: thus I have the form sitting here as part of my account | ||
+ | |||
[14:21] CerebrosuS oh ok, ... so i will give you a pic today | [14:21] CerebrosuS oh ok, ... so i will give you a pic today | ||
+ | |||
[14:22] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: great | [14:22] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: great | ||
+ | |||
[14:22] shaunmcdonald a 16x16 pixel optimized version is also recommended | [14:22] shaunmcdonald a 16x16 pixel optimized version is also recommended | ||
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[14:22] CerebrosuS ok | [14:22] CerebrosuS ok | ||
+ | |||
[14:22] CerebrosuS from what? | [14:22] CerebrosuS from what? | ||
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[14:22] CerebrosuS the normal ooo logo? | [14:22] CerebrosuS the normal ooo logo? | ||
+ | |||
[14:23] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: it request 2 of the same icon, which are different sizes | [14:23] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: it request 2 of the same icon, which are different sizes | ||
+ | |||
[14:24] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: if you want to send 2 screenshots of aqua too, that would be brilliant | [14:24] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: if you want to send 2 screenshots of aqua too, that would be brilliant | ||
− | [14:24] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: when OpenOffice.org Logo is used, I think the best is advertise Louis, and / or Marketing project ( Florian Effenberger is a good candidate ;) ) | + | |
+ | [14:24] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: when OpenOffice.org Logo is used, I think the best is advertise Louis, and / or Marketing project ( Florian Effenberger is a | ||
+ | good candidate ;) ) | ||
+ | |||
[14:24] CerebrosuS of mac aqua? | [14:24] CerebrosuS of mac aqua? | ||
+ | |||
[14:24] CerebrosuS no problem | [14:24] CerebrosuS no problem | ||
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[14:24] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: will the two last one I did on my blog be ok ? | [14:24] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: will the two last one I did on my blog be ok ? | ||
+ | |||
[14:24] CerebrosuS s/mac/ooo | [14:24] CerebrosuS s/mac/ooo | ||
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[14:25] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: requirements are JPEG, GIF, or PNG, with a max size of 480x360 with a mac size of 150k bytes | [14:25] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: requirements are JPEG, GIF, or PNG, with a max size of 480x360 with a mac size of 150k bytes | ||
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[14:25] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: ooo aqua yes | [14:25] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: ooo aqua yes | ||
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[14:26] CerebrosuS ok | [14:26] CerebrosuS ok | ||
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[14:26] * shaunmcdonald thought that the other ooo's mentioned on version tracker included the ooo icon | [14:26] * shaunmcdonald thought that the other ooo's mentioned on version tracker included the ooo icon | ||
+ | |||
[14:27] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: I have screenshots to propose, usijng Tango icons | [14:27] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: I have screenshots to propose, usijng Tango icons | ||
+ | |||
[14:28] shaunmcdonald ericb2: great, send them to CerebrosuS and me please | [14:28] shaunmcdonald ericb2: great, send them to CerebrosuS and me please | ||
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[14:28] shaunmcdonald ericb2: we can only put 2 of them up | [14:28] shaunmcdonald ericb2: we can only put 2 of them up | ||
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[14:28] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: everything is on my site : | [14:28] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: everything is on my site : | ||
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[14:28] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: | [14:28] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: | ||
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[14:28] ericb2 http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/screenshots/july2007/Tango_icons/Draw/Image31.png | [14:28] ericb2 http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/screenshots/july2007/Tango_icons/Draw/Image31.png | ||
+ | |||
[14:28] ericb2 http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/screenshots/july2007/Tango_icons/Draw/Image31_mini.png | [14:28] ericb2 http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/screenshots/july2007/Tango_icons/Draw/Image31_mini.png | ||
+ | |||
[14:28] ericb2 http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/screenshots/july2007/Tango_icons/Calc/calc_Tango07.jpg | [14:28] ericb2 http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/screenshots/july2007/Tango_icons/Calc/calc_Tango07.jpg | ||
+ | |||
+ | |||
[14:29] ericb2 http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/screenshots/july2007/Tango_icons/Calc/calc_Tango07_mini.jpg | [14:29] ericb2 http://eric.bachard.free.fr/mac/aquavcl/screenshots/july2007/Tango_icons/Calc/calc_Tango07_mini.jpg | ||
+ | |||
[14:29] CerebrosuS is itup to me to create free icons, ... or just optimize the standard ooo logo with 2 birds? | [14:29] CerebrosuS is itup to me to create free icons, ... or just optimize the standard ooo logo with 2 birds? | ||
+ | |||
[14:29] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: 400 x 250 for the minis | [14:29] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: 400 x 250 for the minis | ||
+ | |||
[14:29] ericb2 CerebrosuS: we are OpenOffice.org project, and we must use official logos | [14:29] ericb2 CerebrosuS: we are OpenOffice.org project, and we must use official logos | ||
+ | |||
[14:29] CerebrosuS sure ;) np | [14:29] CerebrosuS sure ;) np | ||
+ | |||
[14:30] ericb2 CerebrosuS: please ask louis@ + cc floeff@openoffice.org | [14:30] ericb2 CerebrosuS: please ask louis@ + cc floeff@openoffice.org | ||
+ | |||
[14:30] mav_eric ericb2: I stumpled across an issue with Tango Iconset | [14:30] mav_eric ericb2: I stumpled across an issue with Tango Iconset | ||
+ | |||
[14:31] mav_eric but back to media. | [14:31] mav_eric but back to media. | ||
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[14:31] ericb2 mav_eric: maybe. the problem with crystal and tango is they have a wrong size, and debug assertions always tilt with them ... | [14:31] ericb2 mav_eric: maybe. the problem with crystal and tango is they have a wrong size, and debug assertions always tilt with them ... | ||
+ | |||
[14:31] mav_eric german community informed every media that got informed when snapshot 1 was released | [14:31] mav_eric german community informed every media that got informed when snapshot 1 was released | ||
+ | |||
+ | |||
[14:32] mav_eric ericb2: add to this that if you use Tango or Crystal the "Standard Toolbar" dissappears when loading a template .ott | [14:32] mav_eric ericb2: add to this that if you use Tango or Crystal the "Standard Toolbar" dissappears when loading a template .ott | ||
+ | |||
[14:32] * shaunmcdonald hasn't had time to inform the en media yet | [14:32] * shaunmcdonald hasn't had time to inform the en media yet | ||
+ | |||
[14:32] mav_eric instead it shows two times the "format toolbar" | [14:32] mav_eric instead it shows two times the "format toolbar" | ||
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[14:32] * cremlae has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) | [14:32] * cremlae has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) | ||
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[14:32] * cremlae (n=cremlae@64.122.192.112) has joined #ooo_macport | [14:32] * cremlae (n=cremlae@64.122.192.112) has joined #ooo_macport | ||
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[14:32] ericb2 mav_eric: even reinstalling ? | [14:32] ericb2 mav_eric: even reinstalling ? | ||
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[14:32] mav_eric I think this is normal that a second snapshot isn't that hot a thing | [14:32] mav_eric I think this is normal that a second snapshot isn't that hot a thing | ||
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[14:33] ericb2 mav_eric: there is a generic bug with toolbars | [14:33] ericb2 mav_eric: there is a generic bug with toolbars | ||
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[14:33] mav_eric ericb2: done that. I even deleted my user settings | [14:33] mav_eric ericb2: done that. I even deleted my user settings | ||
+ | |||
[14:33] ericb2 ( toll bars ;) ) | [14:33] ericb2 ( toll bars ;) ) | ||
+ | |||
[14:33] * shaunmcdonald partly wanted to wait a day or two after release to make sure that any teething problems are fixed | [14:33] * shaunmcdonald partly wanted to wait a day or two after release to make sure that any teething problems are fixed | ||
+ | |||
[14:33] mav_eric ericb2: sunrayjogi did confirm that it doesn't occure when using standard Icon set | [14:33] mav_eric ericb2: sunrayjogi did confirm that it doesn't occure when using standard Icon set | ||
+ | |||
[14:33] mav_eric but we didn't want to file an issue before talking to you | [14:33] mav_eric but we didn't want to file an issue before talking to you | ||
+ | |||
[14:34] ericb2 mav_eric: I think you can file an issue, and everyone will track, if ever the issue is repeatable | [14:34] ericb2 mav_eric: I think you can file an issue, and everyone will track, if ever the issue is repeatable | ||
+ | |||
[14:34] mav_eric ericb2: O.K. I'll file an issue once I see a light at the end of the tunnel of work that needs to be done today | [14:34] mav_eric ericb2: O.K. I'll file an issue once I see a light at the end of the tunnel of work that needs to be done today | ||
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[14:35] mav_eric My ISP was down from 15 cet to 21 cet yesterday | [14:35] mav_eric My ISP was down from 15 cet to 21 cet yesterday | ||
+ | |||
[14:36] CerebrosuS email is gone, ... so i will directly optimize the screenshots | [14:36] CerebrosuS email is gone, ... so i will directly optimize the screenshots | ||
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[14:37] * ericb2 declared aquavcl01 "nominated" :) | [14:37] * ericb2 declared aquavcl01 "nominated" :) | ||
+ | |||
[14:37] PhilippL ericb2: yay ! :-) | [14:37] PhilippL ericb2: yay ! :-) | ||
+ | |||
[14:37] ericb2 (Pavel is away for yet one week ) | [14:37] ericb2 (Pavel is away for yet one week ) | ||
+ | |||
[14:37] ericb2 PhilippL: yesss ! | [14:37] ericb2 PhilippL: yesss ! | ||
+ | |||
[14:38] ericb2 congratulations to all developpers who contributed, and let's go for aquavcl02 ! | [14:38] ericb2 congratulations to all developpers who contributed, and let's go for aquavcl02 ! | ||
+ | |||
[14:39] sunrayjogi ericb2: ...ehm.... I am not a developer :-) | [14:39] sunrayjogi ericb2: ...ehm.... I am not a developer :-) | ||
+ | |||
[14:40] ericb2 congratulations to all people (even not developers ) who contributed, and let's go for aquavcl02 ! | [14:40] ericb2 congratulations to all people (even not developers ) who contributed, and let's go for aquavcl02 ! | ||
+ | |||
[14:40] ericb2 sunrayjogi: excuse me :) | [14:40] ericb2 sunrayjogi: excuse me :) | ||
+ | |||
[14:41] ericb2 sunrayjogi: for me you are developer btw | [14:41] ericb2 sunrayjogi: for me you are developer btw | ||
+ | |||
[14:43] ericb2 next point ? | [14:43] ericb2 next point ? | ||
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[14:43] shaunmcdonald sunrayjogi: tester help in the development of the software, therefore in a broad context testers are developers | [14:43] shaunmcdonald sunrayjogi: tester help in the development of the software, therefore in a broad context testers are developers | ||
+ | |||
[14:44] shaunmcdonald 3. aquavcl01 cws integration (part3) | [14:44] shaunmcdonald 3. aquavcl01 cws integration (part3) | ||
+ | |||
[14:44] ismael_ other aqua news | [14:44] ismael_ other aqua news | ||
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[14:44] PhilippL well, it's almost there :-) | [14:44] PhilippL well, it's almost there :-) | ||
+ | |||
[14:45] ismael_ i made listboxes more aqua | [14:45] ismael_ i made listboxes more aqua | ||
+ | |||
[14:45] ericb2 ismael_: great ! | [14:45] ericb2 ismael_: great ! | ||
+ | |||
[14:45] ericb2 ismael_: I read your long patch, and this a great work | [14:45] ericb2 ismael_: I read your long patch, and this a great work | ||
+ | |||
[14:46] shaunmcdonald 4. aquafilepicker01 integration | [14:46] shaunmcdonald 4. aquafilepicker01 integration | ||
− | [14:46] ismael_ i also reviewed my patch for aqua tabs and i plan to commit it, only the part of drawing of tabs not the part which replace several lines of tabs by a listbox | + | |
+ | [14:46] ismael_ i also reviewed my patch for aqua tabs and i plan to commit it, only the part of drawing of tabs not the part which replace several lines of | ||
+ | tabs by a listbox | ||
+ | |||
[14:47] PhilippL ismael_: +1 | [14:47] PhilippL ismael_: +1 | ||
+ | |||
[14:47] ismael_ ericb2:yes it is a bit long as i modified a lots of parts of listboxes | [14:47] ismael_ ericb2:yes it is a bit long as i modified a lots of parts of listboxes | ||
+ | |||
[14:47] ismael_ i also made a patch for removing the bold text of focused tabs | [14:47] ismael_ i also made a patch for removing the bold text of focused tabs | ||
+ | |||
[14:47] ericb2 ismael_: another thing you did, and I found very interesting, was how you solved the "bold" tab issue. Good work | [14:47] ericb2 ismael_: another thing you did, and I found very interesting, was how you solved the "bold" tab issue. Good work | ||
+ | |||
[14:48] ismael_ but this patch concerns not only the macport but at least gnome ooo | [14:48] ismael_ but this patch concerns not only the macport but at least gnome ooo | ||
+ | |||
[14:48] ismael_ so do i commit it only to aquavcl ? | [14:48] ismael_ so do i commit it only to aquavcl ? | ||
+ | |||
[14:49] ericb2 PhilippL: what do you think for gnome part ? | [14:49] ericb2 PhilippL: what do you think for gnome part ? | ||
+ | |||
[14:49] ismael_ although it may profit to other platforms? | [14:49] ismael_ although it may profit to other platforms? | ||
+ | |||
[14:49] PhilippL ericb2: The gnome part is pretty localized and also an improvement, so I think its good. | [14:49] PhilippL ericb2: The gnome part is pretty localized and also an improvement, so I think its good. | ||
+ | |||
[14:51] ericb2 ismael_: you can commit it, and if ever we discover something to change, we have the time with aquavcl02 | [14:51] ericb2 ismael_: you can commit it, and if ever we discover something to change, we have the time with aquavcl02 | ||
+ | |||
[14:51] ismael_ ericb2: so i commit it to aquavcl02? | [14:51] ismael_ ericb2: so i commit it to aquavcl02? | ||
+ | |||
[14:52] ericb2 ismael_: yes | [14:52] ericb2 ismael_: yes | ||
+ | |||
[14:52] ismael_ ericb2: ok | [14:52] ismael_ ericb2: ok | ||
+ | |||
[14:52] ericb2 ismael_: aquavcl01 is closed, and nominated | [14:52] ericb2 ismael_: aquavcl01 is closed, and nominated | ||
+ | |||
[14:52] ismael_ ericb2: and what about for gnome? | [14:52] ismael_ ericb2: and what about for gnome? | ||
+ | |||
[14:53] PhilippL ismael_: commit it to aquavcl02, also. If aquavcl02 doesn't make it into 2.3, then we can merge the change over to some other CWS. | [14:53] PhilippL ismael_: commit it to aquavcl02, also. If aquavcl02 doesn't make it into 2.3, then we can merge the change over to some other CWS. | ||
+ | |||
[14:53] ismael_ PhilippL: ok | [14:53] ismael_ PhilippL: ok | ||
+ | |||
[14:55] ericb2 to close the point, I'll propose, for next meeting, or once Pavel will be back, to define clear objectives for aquavcl02 | [14:55] ericb2 to close the point, I'll propose, for next meeting, or once Pavel will be back, to define clear objectives for aquavcl02 | ||
+ | |||
[14:59] PhilippL next point ? | [14:59] PhilippL next point ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:00] shaunmcdonald 4. aquafilepicker01 integration | [15:00] shaunmcdonald 4. aquafilepicker01 integration | ||
+ | |||
[15:04] shaunmcdonald how is the integration progressing? | [15:04] shaunmcdonald how is the integration progressing? | ||
+ | |||
[15:04] ericb2 I think only Florian Heckl can answer. Currently they are open issues | [15:04] ericb2 I think only Florian Heckl can answer. Currently they are open issues | ||
+ | |||
[15:04] ericb2 I have no other information | [15:04] ericb2 I have no other information | ||
+ | |||
[15:05] ericb2 according to EIS, aquafilepicker01 is in new state | [15:05] ericb2 according to EIS, aquafilepicker01 is in new state | ||
+ | |||
[15:05] ericb2 Back to new - because of two crashes. | [15:05] ericb2 Back to new - because of two crashes. | ||
+ | |||
[15:05] ericb2 #i77843# | [15:05] ericb2 #i77843# | ||
+ | |||
[15:05] shaunmcdonald ericb2: ok | [15:05] shaunmcdonald ericb2: ok | ||
+ | |||
[15:06] shaunmcdonald lets move on | [15:06] shaunmcdonald lets move on | ||
+ | |||
[15:06] shaunmcdonald 5. development after aquavcl01 | [15:06] shaunmcdonald 5. development after aquavcl01 | ||
− | [15:06] IZBot porting DEFECT STARTED P2 OOo crashes upon clicking Finish in database wizard with Native File Picker http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=77843 | + | |
+ | [15:06] IZBot porting DEFECT STARTED P2 OOo crashes upon clicking Finish in database wizard with Native File Picker http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/ | ||
+ | show_bug.cgi?id=77843 | ||
+ | |||
[15:06] PhilippL I propose to begin Cocoa transition. | [15:06] PhilippL I propose to begin Cocoa transition. | ||
+ | |||
[15:06] * mod__ just wants to mention, that the good news was in German media, stating that the port is making huge progress | [15:06] * mod__ just wants to mention, that the good news was in German media, stating that the port is making huge progress | ||
+ | |||
[15:06] shaunmcdonald mod__: great | [15:06] shaunmcdonald mod__: great | ||
+ | |||
[15:06] sunrayjogi PhilippL: You have fun with the Mac, haven't you? .-) | [15:06] sunrayjogi PhilippL: You have fun with the Mac, haven't you? .-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:06] PhilippL Anything we do now in carbon will need to be converted to cocoa else. | [15:06] PhilippL Anything we do now in carbon will need to be converted to cocoa else. | ||
+ | |||
[15:06] ericb2 PhilippL: ok. Noticed | [15:06] ericb2 PhilippL: ok. Noticed | ||
+ | |||
[15:08] hdu_hh I suggest to use aquavcl02 to make Aqua2.3 usable, then do the Cocoa transition | [15:08] hdu_hh I suggest to use aquavcl02 to make Aqua2.3 usable, then do the Cocoa transition | ||
+ | |||
[15:08] ericb2 PhilippL: the most urgent is to define clearly what we do : wrap ObjC or use objc++ directly | [15:08] ericb2 PhilippL: the most urgent is to define clearly what we do : wrap ObjC or use objc++ directly | ||
+ | |||
[15:09] shaunmcdonald making ooo useable is most important | [15:09] shaunmcdonald making ooo useable is most important | ||
+ | |||
[15:09] ericb2 PhilippL: I think hdu_hh proposal is a good idea | [15:09] ericb2 PhilippL: I think hdu_hh proposal is a good idea | ||
+ | |||
[15:09] ericb2 PhilippL: and I'd vote for : start to define rules, but complete usability first | [15:09] ericb2 PhilippL: and I'd vote for : start to define rules, but complete usability first | ||
+ | |||
[15:09] shaunmcdonald later do the transition to cocoa, say in aquavcl03 | [15:09] shaunmcdonald later do the transition to cocoa, say in aquavcl03 | ||
+ | |||
[15:09] PhilippL me not. We'll have to postpone accessibility implementation then. | [15:09] PhilippL me not. We'll have to postpone accessibility implementation then. | ||
+ | |||
[15:10] PhilippL just to implement everthing again ? | [15:10] PhilippL just to implement everthing again ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:10] shaunmcdonald then thereafter, we can look into other things like scriptability | [15:10] shaunmcdonald then thereafter, we can look into other things like scriptability | ||
+ | |||
[15:10] sunrayjogi who will fix issue 79212 | [15:10] sunrayjogi who will fix issue 79212 | ||
+ | |||
[15:10] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: anything new will be done in Cocoa | [15:10] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: anything new will be done in Cocoa | ||
+ | |||
[15:10] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212 | [15:10] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212 | ||
+ | |||
[15:10] PhilippL shaunmcdonald: Which will be exactly nothing unless we start to make cocoa useable. | [15:10] PhilippL shaunmcdonald: Which will be exactly nothing unless we start to make cocoa useable. | ||
+ | |||
[15:11] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: are we that far through the implementation already? | [15:11] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: are we that far through the implementation already? | ||
+ | |||
[15:11] ericb2 PhilippL: we have deep changes, starting with window, frame and events | [15:11] ericb2 PhilippL: we have deep changes, starting with window, frame and events | ||
+ | |||
[15:11] PhilippL ericb2: yes, exactly, and the longer we wait the worse the change gets. | [15:11] PhilippL ericb2: yes, exactly, and the longer we wait the worse the change gets. | ||
+ | |||
[15:12] ericb2 PhilippL: can drag and drop we implemented without Cocoa. This is imho the only basic missing feature | [15:12] ericb2 PhilippL: can drag and drop we implemented without Cocoa. This is imho the only basic missing feature | ||
+ | |||
[15:12] ericb2 ? | [15:12] ericb2 ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:13] ericb2 PhilippL: another question : will we manage .nib files ? | [15:13] ericb2 PhilippL: another question : will we manage .nib files ? | ||
+ | |||
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[15:13] PhilippL ericb2: I don't think so. What would we do with tem ? | [15:13] PhilippL ericb2: I don't think so. What would we do with tem ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:13] hdu_hh ericb2: click on document => OOo opens the document would be a basic feature too | [15:13] hdu_hh ericb2: click on document => OOo opens the document would be a basic feature too | ||
+ | |||
[15:13] ericb2 hdu_hh: does the attached patch work ? | [15:13] ericb2 hdu_hh: does the attached patch work ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:13] shaunmcdonald do we have a list of this is implemented, and this needs to be implemented in the future? | [15:13] shaunmcdonald do we have a list of this is implemented, and this needs to be implemented in the future? | ||
+ | |||
[15:14] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: that's waht I had in mind for newt meeting | [15:14] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: that's waht I had in mind for newt meeting | ||
+ | |||
[15:14] shaunmcdonald hdu_hh: I think that can be done without cocoa? | [15:14] shaunmcdonald hdu_hh: I think that can be done without cocoa? | ||
+ | |||
[15:14] ericb2 s/newt/newt/ | [15:14] ericb2 s/newt/newt/ | ||
+ | |||
[15:14] ericb2 next | [15:14] ericb2 next | ||
+ | |||
[15:14] ericb2 oh | [15:14] ericb2 oh | ||
+ | |||
[15:14] hdu_hh the AppleEvents are a Carbon thing | [15:14] hdu_hh the AppleEvents are a Carbon thing | ||
+ | |||
[15:14] shaunmcdonald ericb2: then we can push each item into a aquavcl0X release | [15:14] shaunmcdonald ericb2: then we can push each item into a aquavcl0X release | ||
+ | |||
[15:15] shaunmcdonald hdu_hh: AppleEvents cannot be used in Cocoa? | [15:15] shaunmcdonald hdu_hh: AppleEvents cannot be used in Cocoa? | ||
+ | |||
[15:15] ericb2 hdu_hh: right | [15:15] ericb2 hdu_hh: right | ||
+ | |||
[15:15] hdu_hh shaunmacdonald: they probably can, but the APIs are documented in the Carbon section | [15:15] hdu_hh shaunmacdonald: they probably can, but the APIs are documented in the Carbon section | ||
+ | |||
[15:15] PhilippL just another thing that needs to be redone. | [15:15] PhilippL just another thing that needs to be redone. | ||
+ | |||
[15:16] hdu_hh maybe they'll deprecate them too sooner or later | [15:16] hdu_hh maybe they'll deprecate them too sooner or later | ||
+ | |||
[15:16] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: Apple often deprecate things, like processor types :-) | [15:16] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: Apple often deprecate things, like processor types :-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:16] ericb2 hdu_hh: unfortunaly , I think so | [15:16] ericb2 hdu_hh: unfortunaly , I think so | ||
+ | |||
[15:17] sunrayjogi PhilippL: Is it possible to mix Cocoa and Carbon? | [15:17] sunrayjogi PhilippL: Is it possible to mix Cocoa and Carbon? | ||
+ | |||
[15:17] >mod__< do you have link(s) for german press ? | [15:17] >mod__< do you have link(s) for german press ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:17] PhilippL sunrayjogi: yes. | [15:17] PhilippL sunrayjogi: yes. | ||
+ | |||
[15:17] PhilippL sunrayjogi: or so says apple. | [15:17] PhilippL sunrayjogi: or so says apple. | ||
+ | |||
[15:17] sunrayjogi PhilippL: So we only have to define which part needs to be written in Cocoa... the rest can be used as it is? | [15:17] sunrayjogi PhilippL: So we only have to define which part needs to be written in Cocoa... the rest can be used as it is? | ||
− | [15:18] mav_eric Even without beeing a developer it seems reasonable to make the transistion to Cocoa early enough so that we don't have a final Carbon app needing to ported to Cocoa in full | + | |
+ | [15:18] mav_eric Even without beeing a developer it seems reasonable to make the transistion to Cocoa early enough so that we don't have a final Carbon | ||
+ | app needing to ported to Cocoa in full | ||
+ | |||
[15:18] mav_eric sunrayjogi: yes. you can mix Cocoa and Carbon | [15:18] mav_eric sunrayjogi: yes. you can mix Cocoa and Carbon | ||
+ | |||
[15:18] PhilippL sunrayjogi: The problem is that Carbon UI is deprecated nowadays. | [15:18] PhilippL sunrayjogi: The problem is that Carbon UI is deprecated nowadays. | ||
+ | |||
[15:18] mav_eric sunrayjogi: it can be used but not in 64bit | [15:18] mav_eric sunrayjogi: it can be used but not in 64bit | ||
+ | |||
[15:19] sunrayjogi PhilippL: I know | [15:19] sunrayjogi PhilippL: I know | ||
+ | |||
[15:19] mav_eric 64bit - is strictly cocoa and carbon will be frozen at the current stat | [15:19] mav_eric 64bit - is strictly cocoa and carbon will be frozen at the current stat | ||
+ | |||
[15:19] mav_eric state | [15:19] mav_eric state | ||
+ | |||
[15:19] mav_eric and more sooner than later vanish | [15:19] mav_eric and more sooner than later vanish | ||
+ | |||
[15:19] sunrayjogi mav_eric: I am very interested what M$ will do with their old Carbon app .... | [15:19] sunrayjogi mav_eric: I am very interested what M$ will do with their old Carbon app .... | ||
+ | |||
[15:20] mav_eric sunrayjogi: i assume they rewrote parts of MSO 2008 in Cocoa | [15:20] mav_eric sunrayjogi: i assume they rewrote parts of MSO 2008 in Cocoa | ||
+ | |||
[15:20] ericb2 sunrayjogi: you can belive me : Microsfot has resources | [15:20] ericb2 sunrayjogi: you can belive me : Microsfot has resources | ||
+ | |||
[15:20] mav_eric they may have faced the same problem we're now facing but may have known earlier | [15:20] mav_eric they may have faced the same problem we're now facing but may have known earlier | ||
+ | |||
+ | |||
[15:20] ericb2 sunrayjogi: 180 developers are working for the next Mac Office version | [15:20] ericb2 sunrayjogi: 180 developers are working for the next Mac Office version | ||
[15:20] mav_eric ok. were just 178 behind :-) | [15:20] mav_eric ok. were just 178 behind :-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:21] ExLachs sunrayjogi, issue 79212 has a patch attached. can someone try it? | [15:21] ExLachs sunrayjogi, issue 79212 has a patch attached. can someone try it? | ||
+ | |||
[15:21] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212 | [15:21] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212 | ||
+ | |||
[15:21] ericb2 Can we define priorities ? | [15:21] ericb2 Can we define priorities ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:23] mav_eric my proposal: 1. new features - Cocoa only | [15:23] mav_eric my proposal: 1. new features - Cocoa only | ||
+ | |||
[15:23] mav_eric 2. move old deprecated carbon to Cocoa | [15:23] mav_eric 2. move old deprecated carbon to Cocoa | ||
+ | |||
[15:24] ismael_ FYI, mikesic is working on a cocoa spellchecker | [15:24] ismael_ FYI, mikesic is working on a cocoa spellchecker | ||
+ | |||
[15:24] mav_eric 3. if necessary features freeze until the move to Cocoa is done | [15:24] mav_eric 3. if necessary features freeze until the move to Cocoa is done | ||
+ | |||
[15:24] ismael_ so "cocoa transition" has already started in a certain way | [15:24] ismael_ so "cocoa transition" has already started in a certain way | ||
+ | |||
[15:24] hdu_hh mav_eric: 4. have a usable AquaOOo 2.3 | [15:24] hdu_hh mav_eric: 4. have a usable AquaOOo 2.3 | ||
+ | |||
[15:24] * ericb2 proposes something different : 1) what is needed | [15:24] * ericb2 proposes something different : 1) what is needed | ||
+ | |||
[15:25] mav_eric hdu_hh: could be a nice side effect :-) | [15:25] mav_eric hdu_hh: could be a nice side effect :-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:25] ericb2 1) define a limit for current port | [15:25] ericb2 1) define a limit for current port | ||
− | [15:25] PhilippL mav_eric: Some things will not be moved to Cocoa since they do not exist there example: HITheme API. But I think there shouldn't be many more. | + | |
+ | [15:25] PhilippL mav_eric: Some things will not be moved to Cocoa since they do not exist there example: HITheme API. But I think there shouldn't be many | ||
+ | more. | ||
+ | |||
[15:25] mav_eric PhilippL: so this needs to be redone in Cocoa once Carbon is "gone" | [15:25] mav_eric PhilippL: so this needs to be redone in Cocoa once Carbon is "gone" | ||
− | [15:25] * shaunmcdonald hopes the new spell checker will be better than the Mac OS X spell checker, which removes the underline when you are editing a mis-spelled word | + | |
+ | [15:25] * shaunmcdonald hopes the new spell checker will be better than the Mac OS X spell checker, which removes the underline when you are editing a | ||
+ | mis-spelled word | ||
+ | |||
[15:25] ericb2 PhilippL: we have code for HIView ( at least we don't start from scratch) | [15:25] ericb2 PhilippL: we have code for HIView ( at least we don't start from scratch) | ||
+ | |||
[15:26] PhilippL mav_eric: There are two possibilities: 1. Apple implements a theme API for Cocoa, too ( a radar issue exists for that ) | [15:26] PhilippL mav_eric: There are two possibilities: 1. Apple implements a theme API for Cocoa, too ( a radar issue exists for that ) | ||
− | [15:26] PhilippL mav_eric: Or 2), we switch our UI to native Cocoa controls (actually to native controls on all platforms). This however would be a long, evolutinary migration process. | + | |
+ | [15:26] PhilippL mav_eric: Or 2), we switch our UI to native Cocoa controls (actually to native controls on all platforms). This however would be a long, | ||
+ | evolutinary migration process. | ||
+ | |||
[15:27] ericb2 PhilippL: about HITheme, my sources told me : No ( but maybe my sources are not good .. ) | [15:27] ericb2 PhilippL: about HITheme, my sources told me : No ( but maybe my sources are not good .. ) | ||
+ | |||
[15:27] mav_eric PhilippL: O.k. so some things need to stay carbon while the long evolution is gone? | [15:27] mav_eric PhilippL: O.k. so some things need to stay carbon while the long evolution is gone? | ||
+ | |||
[15:27] ismael_ shaunmcdonald: it will be the native mac os spellchecker | [15:27] ismael_ shaunmcdonald: it will be the native mac os spellchecker | ||
+ | |||
[15:27] PhilippL mav_eric: yes. | [15:27] PhilippL mav_eric: yes. | ||
+ | |||
[15:28] * Fridrich has quit (Remote closed the connection) | [15:28] * Fridrich has quit (Remote closed the connection) | ||
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[15:28] PhilippL mav_eric: However our AquaSalFrame should move to Cocoa so the Accessibilty implementation can base on that. | [15:28] PhilippL mav_eric: However our AquaSalFrame should move to Cocoa so the Accessibilty implementation can base on that. | ||
+ | |||
[15:28] mav_eric PhilippL: O.K. this even sounds to me as a no coder good | [15:28] mav_eric PhilippL: O.K. this even sounds to me as a no coder good | ||
+ | |||
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[15:28] * ChanServ gives channel operator status to Fridrich | [15:28] * ChanServ gives channel operator status to Fridrich | ||
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[15:28] ericb2 FYI, what is currently missing : | [15:28] ericb2 FYI, what is currently missing : | ||
+ | |||
[15:28] ericb2 drag and drop | [15:28] ericb2 drag and drop | ||
+ | |||
[15:28] ericb2 resolution issues | [15:28] ericb2 resolution issues | ||
+ | |||
[15:28] ericb2 click on document => OOo opens the document | [15:28] ericb2 click on document => OOo opens the document | ||
+ | |||
[15:28] ericb2 native filepicker | [15:28] ericb2 native filepicker | ||
+ | |||
[15:28] ericb2 add more Aqua look | [15:28] ericb2 add more Aqua look | ||
+ | |||
[15:29] ericb2 this list could close the first aqua implementation, (and close aquavcl02) | [15:29] ericb2 this list could close the first aqua implementation, (and close aquavcl02) | ||
+ | |||
[15:29] PhilippL ericb2: multi display support, plugins, applets, tons of stuff ;-) | [15:29] PhilippL ericb2: multi display support, plugins, applets, tons of stuff ;-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:29] ericb2 PhilippL: later | [15:29] ericb2 PhilippL: later | ||
+ | |||
[15:29] ericb2 PhilippL: whith my list, 90% of people (maybe more), are happy | [15:29] ericb2 PhilippL: whith my list, 90% of people (maybe more), are happy | ||
+ | |||
[15:30] mav_eric PhilippL: ericb2 is right. First we need to cover the 10% of the basic features mosten used | [15:30] mav_eric PhilippL: ericb2 is right. First we need to cover the 10% of the basic features mosten used | ||
+ | |||
[15:30] PhilippL We don't reach beta quality until we are feature complete. | [15:30] PhilippL We don't reach beta quality until we are feature complete. | ||
+ | |||
[15:31] shaunmcdonald muti display is important for presentations | [15:31] shaunmcdonald muti display is important for presentations | ||
+ | |||
[15:31] PhilippL That's basically the defintion of beta. | [15:31] PhilippL That's basically the defintion of beta. | ||
+ | |||
[15:31] * shaunmcdonald thought applets within ooo had been disabled a long time ago due to security | [15:31] * shaunmcdonald thought applets within ooo had been disabled a long time ago due to security | ||
+ | |||
[15:31] PhilippL However you are of course right, that aquavcl02 should not be feature complete yet. | [15:31] PhilippL However you are of course right, that aquavcl02 should not be feature complete yet. | ||
+ | |||
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[15:31] mav_eric PhilippL: so you want an "old school" beta? | [15:31] mav_eric PhilippL: so you want an "old school" beta? | ||
+ | |||
[15:32] PhilippL mav_eric: I wouldn't call what we have now or after aquavcl02 a "beta" | [15:32] PhilippL mav_eric: I wouldn't call what we have now or after aquavcl02 a "beta" | ||
+ | |||
[15:32] mav_eric PhilippL: agreed | [15:32] mav_eric PhilippL: agreed | ||
− | [15:32] ericb2 PhilippL: aquavcl0" can be created now if you want, and in parallel, becaue experimental. and if ever progress are fast, we could modify our timeline | + | |
+ | [15:32] ericb2 PhilippL: aquavcl0" can be created now if you want, and in parallel, becaue experimental. and if ever progress are fast, we could modify our | ||
+ | timeline | ||
+ | |||
[15:32] PhilippL mav_eric: A beta should basically be reached when OOo 3.0 gets "beta", which is somewhen next year ? | [15:32] PhilippL mav_eric: A beta should basically be reached when OOo 3.0 gets "beta", which is somewhen next year ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:32] mav_eric PhilippL: yes. There is a wiki page about this. | [15:32] mav_eric PhilippL: yes. There is a wiki page about this. | ||
+ | |||
[15:33] * ericb2 meant aquavlc03 could be created | [15:33] * ericb2 meant aquavlc03 could be created | ||
+ | |||
[15:33] shaunmcdonald a plugin for web browsers would be good as linux and windows has that | [15:33] shaunmcdonald a plugin for web browsers would be good as linux and windows has that | ||
+ | |||
[15:33] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: later, this is gadget | [15:33] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: later, this is gadget | ||
+ | |||
[15:33] shaunmcdonald the beta for ooo 3.0 is the start of next year | [15:33] shaunmcdonald the beta for ooo 3.0 is the start of next year | ||
+ | |||
[15:33] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: compared to drag and drop | [15:33] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: compared to drag and drop | ||
+ | |||
[15:33] shaunmcdonald ericb2: of course, it is on a "later" list | [15:33] shaunmcdonald ericb2: of course, it is on a "later" list | ||
+ | |||
[15:34] ericb2 Can we summarize ? | [15:34] ericb2 Can we summarize ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:34] * obr thinks webbrowser plugin should be done with xslt transforms (also on other platforms) | [15:34] * obr thinks webbrowser plugin should be done with xslt transforms (also on other platforms) | ||
+ | |||
[15:34] shaunmcdonald ooo 2.0 feature freeze is march 2008 http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/OOoRelease30 | [15:34] shaunmcdonald ooo 2.0 feature freeze is march 2008 http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/OOoRelease30 | ||
+ | |||
[15:35] shaunmcdonald s/ooo 2.0/ooo 3.0 | [15:35] shaunmcdonald s/ooo 2.0/ooo 3.0 | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 I propose : | [15:37] ericb2 I propose : | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 Aquavcl02 objectives : | [15:37] ericb2 Aquavcl02 objectives : | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 Achieve first Aqua version | [15:37] ericb2 Achieve first Aqua version | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 drag and drop | [15:37] ericb2 drag and drop | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 resolution issues | [15:37] ericb2 resolution issues | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 click on document => OOo opens the document | [15:37] ericb2 click on document => OOo opens the document | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 native filepicker | [15:37] ericb2 native filepicker | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 add more Aqua look | [15:37] ericb2 add more Aqua look | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 Aquavcl03 : | [15:37] ericb2 Aquavcl03 : | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 Start Cocoa migration | [15:37] ericb2 Start Cocoa migration | ||
+ | |||
[15:37] ericb2 Opinions ? | [15:37] ericb2 Opinions ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:38] PhilippL ok, let's do that | [15:38] PhilippL ok, let's do that | ||
+ | |||
[15:38] ericb2 both cws can start today | [15:38] ericb2 both cws can start today | ||
+ | |||
[15:38] ericb2 +1 for me | [15:38] ericb2 +1 for me | ||
+ | |||
[15:38] PhilippL aquavcl02 is running already. | [15:38] PhilippL aquavcl02 is running already. | ||
+ | |||
[15:38] hdu_hh +1 from me too | [15:38] hdu_hh +1 from me too | ||
+ | |||
[15:39] ericb2 PhilippL: yes :) | [15:39] ericb2 PhilippL: yes :) | ||
+ | |||
[15:39] ericb2 of course, other issues fixd in meantime are welcome :) | [15:39] ericb2 of course, other issues fixd in meantime are welcome :) | ||
+ | |||
[15:40] * shaunmcdonald wonders what happens with changes in 1 CWS affecting/causing conflict with the other | [15:40] * shaunmcdonald wonders what happens with changes in 1 CWS affecting/causing conflict with the other | ||
+ | |||
[15:40] * sunrayjogi will like it to see the old "interface builder" from NeXT again ;-) | [15:40] * sunrayjogi will like it to see the old "interface builder" from NeXT again ;-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:41] mav_eric sunrayjogi: doesn't it kind of still exist in the Interface Builder? | [15:41] mav_eric sunrayjogi: doesn't it kind of still exist in the Interface Builder? | ||
+ | |||
[15:41] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: issue 79212 has a patch - could you add it to aquavcl02? | [15:41] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: issue 79212 has a patch - could you add it to aquavcl02? | ||
+ | |||
[15:41] ericb2 Next point ? | [15:41] ericb2 Next point ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:41] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212 | [15:41] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212 | ||
+ | |||
[15:42] sunrayjogi mav_eric: ? | [15:42] sunrayjogi mav_eric: ? | ||
+ | |||
[15:42] mav_eric sunrayjogi: With the developer tools there is an app called "Interface Builder" installed | [15:42] mav_eric sunrayjogi: With the developer tools there is an app called "Interface Builder" installed | ||
+ | |||
[15:42] sunrayjogi sunrayjogi: yes, it makes no sense to use it in carbon AFAIK; Its for Cocoa apps | [15:42] sunrayjogi sunrayjogi: yes, it makes no sense to use it in carbon AFAIK; Its for Cocoa apps | ||
+ | |||
[15:43] hdu_hh ericb2: will do | [15:43] hdu_hh ericb2: will do | ||
+ | |||
[15:43] sunrayjogi mav_eric: we're on the way to Cocoa, so maybe it will make sense to have a look at it - after many years of abstinence | [15:43] sunrayjogi mav_eric: we're on the way to Cocoa, so maybe it will make sense to have a look at it - after many years of abstinence | ||
+ | |||
[15:43] shaunmcdonald 6. testtool and its packaging in the application bundle | [15:43] shaunmcdonald 6. testtool and its packaging in the application bundle | ||
+ | |||
[15:43] * sunrayjogi has started with NEXTSTEP | [15:43] * sunrayjogi has started with NEXTSTEP | ||
+ | |||
[15:43] mav_eric sunrayjogi: That's a descision to be made by the devs and they seem to favour other ways | [15:43] mav_eric sunrayjogi: That's a descision to be made by the devs and they seem to favour other ways | ||
+ | |||
[15:44] mav_eric decission | [15:44] mav_eric decission | ||
+ | |||
[15:44] * divoe has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) | [15:44] * divoe has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) | ||
+ | |||
[15:45] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: will do | [15:45] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: will do | ||
+ | |||
[15:45] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: fine... on friday I will have self-made schoko crossies for my devs :-) (if my daughter won't eat them all) | [15:45] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: fine... on friday I will have self-made schoko crossies for my devs :-) (if my daughter won't eat them all) | ||
+ | |||
[15:46] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: mmmh :-) | [15:46] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: mmmh :-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:46] sunrayjogi mav_eric: we will see... I haven't seen a GUI designer for VCL.... | [15:46] sunrayjogi mav_eric: we will see... I haven't seen a GUI designer for VCL.... | ||
+ | |||
[15:46] mav_eric sunrayjogi: I once was able to modify and existing GUI and it was pretty self explaining | [15:46] mav_eric sunrayjogi: I once was able to modify and existing GUI and it was pretty self explaining | ||
+ | |||
[15:46] ericb2 Next point ? :-) | [15:46] ericb2 Next point ? :-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:46] mav_eric sunrayjogi: we should get rid of vcl ;-) | [15:46] mav_eric sunrayjogi: we should get rid of vcl ;-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:47] PhilippL sunrayjogi: I wouldn't bereave your daughter of chocolate :-) | [15:47] PhilippL sunrayjogi: I wouldn't bereave your daughter of chocolate :-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:47] hdu_hh mav_eric: where is the patch? | [15:47] hdu_hh mav_eric: where is the patch? | ||
+ | |||
[15:47] ericb2 hdu_hh: ;) | [15:47] ericb2 hdu_hh: ;) | ||
+ | |||
[15:47] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: -> ask Gregor | [15:47] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: -> ask Gregor | ||
+ | |||
[15:47] sunrayjogi ExLachs: PATCH? | [15:47] sunrayjogi ExLachs: PATCH? | ||
+ | |||
[15:47] mav_eric hdu_hh: no idea? | [15:47] mav_eric hdu_hh: no idea? | ||
+ | |||
[15:48] hdu_hh mav_eric: the patch to replace vcl with something better ;-) | [15:48] hdu_hh mav_eric: the patch to replace vcl with something better ;-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:48] shaunmcdonald 6. testtool and its packaging in the application bundle | [15:48] shaunmcdonald 6. testtool and its packaging in the application bundle | ||
+ | |||
[15:48] mav_eric hdu_hh: hmm. Nowhere. | [15:48] mav_eric hdu_hh: hmm. Nowhere. | ||
+ | |||
[15:49] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: see attachment from gh - there is the patch | [15:49] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: see attachment from gh - there is the patch | ||
+ | |||
[15:49] ExLachs sunrayjogi, second attachment to issue 79212 | [15:49] ExLachs sunrayjogi, second attachment to issue 79212 | ||
+ | |||
[15:49] sunrayjogi ExLachs: jaja ;-) | [15:49] sunrayjogi ExLachs: jaja ;-) | ||
+ | |||
[15:49] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: ok | [15:49] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: ok | ||
+ | |||
[15:49] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212 | [15:49] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212 | ||
+ | |||
[15:49] sunrayjogi shaunmcdonald: is it important? | [15:49] sunrayjogi shaunmcdonald: is it important? | ||
+ | |||
[15:49] ExLachs but I couldn't try it so first test please | [15:49] ExLachs but I couldn't try it so first test please | ||
[15:49] sunrayjogi shaunmcdonald: There is a need for us that it can be run. | [15:49] sunrayjogi shaunmcdonald: There is a need for us that it can be run. | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:50] <shaunmcdonald> sunrayjogi: it doesn't matter if testtool uses native aqua menus | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:50] <sunrayjogi> hdu_hh: you have read Gregors words ? TEST ... :-) | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:50] * cloph_away is now known as cloph | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:50] <shaunmcdonald> sunrayjogi: in theory we could disable them for testtool | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:51] <sunrayjogi> shaunmcdonald: I did so. I do not want that. | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:51] <ExLachs> sunrayjogi, hdu_hh have to go now | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:51] <shaunmcdonald> sunrayjogi: I mean disable at compile time | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:51] <sunrayjogi> shaunmcdonald: I would like to test what we will see and not something special... | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:52] <sunrayjogi> hdu_hh: on OOO hdu in IZ? | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:52] <shaunmcdonald> sunrayjogi: is it just testtool that has the problem, or is it the full ooo too? | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:52] <hdu_hh> sunrayjogi: yes | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:52] <ExLachs> it seem as it the livemenu tries to read the appmenu which is updated by the currently displayed document. This happens while the | ||
+ | document is still in corntructor this it fails. | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:52] <sunrayjogi> shaunmcdonald: -> ask the creator of TT not me (ExLachs) | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:53] * shaunmcdonald currently thinks it is just the testtool app that has the problem and not the main ooo app when running tests | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:53] * shaunmcdonald hasn't worked with the aqua testtool yet | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:53] <ExLachs> seems to be TT only, but sunrayjogi should know about OOo. just reset the env variable before starting OOo and you will see. | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:54] <sunrayjogi> ExLachs: I will give it a try | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:55] <ExLachs> ok gone now!! | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:55] <hdu_hh> ExLachs: bye! | ||
+ | |||
+ | [15:55] <sunrayjogi> ExLachs: cul8er |
Revision as of 13:59, 4 July 2007
Aquavcl02 objectives :
Achieve first Aqua version
drag and drop resolution issues click on document => OOo opens the document native filepicker add more Aqua look
Aquavcl03 :
Start Cocoa migration
[14:09] shaunmcdonald 2. Latest Aqua news / Work in progress
[14:09] hdu_hh handling AppleEvents
[14:10] PhilippL aquavcl01 is ready for nomination.
[14:10] shaunmcdonald The 2nd preview release has been out in the wild for a couple of days now
[14:11] shaunmcdonald there has been a few useful issues
[14:11] CerebrosuS getKeyName implementation in AquaSalFrame
[14:11] shaunmcdonald not much in terms of other publicity yet
[14:11] hdu_hh there seems to be much less public interest in the 2nd preview. Why? This is usable for many tasks now while the old release wasn't
[14:12] shaunmcdonald It doesn't seem to have gone into the versiontracker mail
[14:12] PhilippL hdu_hh: sic transit gloria mundi ...
[14:12] shaunmcdonald the X11 version got there though
[14:13] shaunmcdonald 1,899 referals from versiontracker for the X11
[14:13] shaunmcdonald version of ooo 2.2.1
[14:15] sunrayjogi ExLachs: no
[14:15] shaunmcdonald now that aqua 2nd preview has been out for a few days and initial distribution problems are sorted, we should start speaking to some media
[14:16] PhilippL media ?
[14:16] shaunmcdonald we have had 464 referalls from version tracker for the current aqua version
[14:16] * ericb2 back
[14:16] ericb2 sorry , very busy today
[14:16] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: mac news sites
[14:17] shaunmcdonald ericb2: no problem, we're now at item 2 of the agenda
[14:17] shaunmcdonald http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/32607 is the aqua version of ooo
[14:17] * shaunmcdonald thinks we should upload an icon for it
[14:18] shaunmcdonald a 32x32 picel 24 bit png icon is needed
[14:20] * CerebrosuS could create one, ... from an ooo icon, ... but where or how to upload it?
[14:20] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: I have developer access to the ooo products in VersionTracker
[14:21] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: thus I have the form sitting here as part of my account
[14:21] CerebrosuS oh ok, ... so i will give you a pic today
[14:22] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: great
[14:22] shaunmcdonald a 16x16 pixel optimized version is also recommended
[14:22] CerebrosuS ok
[14:22] CerebrosuS from what?
[14:22] CerebrosuS the normal ooo logo?
[14:23] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: it request 2 of the same icon, which are different sizes
[14:24] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: if you want to send 2 screenshots of aqua too, that would be brilliant
[14:24] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: when OpenOffice.org Logo is used, I think the best is advertise Louis, and / or Marketing project ( Florian Effenberger is a good candidate ;) )
[14:24] CerebrosuS of mac aqua?
[14:24] CerebrosuS no problem
[14:24] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: will the two last one I did on my blog be ok ?
[14:24] CerebrosuS s/mac/ooo
[14:25] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: requirements are JPEG, GIF, or PNG, with a max size of 480x360 with a mac size of 150k bytes
[14:25] shaunmcdonald CerebrosuS: ooo aqua yes
[14:26] CerebrosuS ok
[14:26] * shaunmcdonald thought that the other ooo's mentioned on version tracker included the ooo icon
[14:27] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: I have screenshots to propose, usijng Tango icons
[14:28] shaunmcdonald ericb2: great, send them to CerebrosuS and me please
[14:28] shaunmcdonald ericb2: we can only put 2 of them up
[14:28] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: everything is on my site :
[14:28] ericb2 shaunmcdonald:
[14:28] ericb2
[14:28] ericb2
[14:28] ericb2
[14:29] ericb2
[14:29] CerebrosuS is itup to me to create free icons, ... or just optimize the standard ooo logo with 2 birds?
[14:29] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: 400 x 250 for the minis
[14:29] ericb2 CerebrosuS: we are OpenOffice.org project, and we must use official logos
[14:29] CerebrosuS sure ;) np
[14:30] ericb2 CerebrosuS: please ask louis@ + cc floeff@openoffice.org
[14:30] mav_eric ericb2: I stumpled across an issue with Tango Iconset
[14:31] mav_eric but back to media.
[14:31] ericb2 mav_eric: maybe. the problem with crystal and tango is they have a wrong size, and debug assertions always tilt with them ...
[14:31] mav_eric german community informed every media that got informed when snapshot 1 was released
[14:32] mav_eric ericb2: add to this that if you use Tango or Crystal the "Standard Toolbar" dissappears when loading a template .ott
[14:32] * shaunmcdonald hasn't had time to inform the en media yet
[14:32] mav_eric instead it shows two times the "format toolbar"
[14:32] * cremlae has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
[14:32] * cremlae (n=cremlae@64.122.192.112) has joined #ooo_macport
[14:32] ericb2 mav_eric: even reinstalling ?
[14:32] mav_eric I think this is normal that a second snapshot isn't that hot a thing
[14:33] ericb2 mav_eric: there is a generic bug with toolbars
[14:33] mav_eric ericb2: done that. I even deleted my user settings
[14:33] ericb2 ( toll bars ;) )
[14:33] * shaunmcdonald partly wanted to wait a day or two after release to make sure that any teething problems are fixed
[14:33] mav_eric ericb2: sunrayjogi did confirm that it doesn't occure when using standard Icon set
[14:33] mav_eric but we didn't want to file an issue before talking to you
[14:34] ericb2 mav_eric: I think you can file an issue, and everyone will track, if ever the issue is repeatable
[14:34] mav_eric ericb2: O.K. I'll file an issue once I see a light at the end of the tunnel of work that needs to be done today
[14:35] mav_eric My ISP was down from 15 cet to 21 cet yesterday
[14:36] CerebrosuS email is gone, ... so i will directly optimize the screenshots
[14:37] * ericb2 declared aquavcl01 "nominated" :)
[14:37] PhilippL ericb2: yay ! :-)
[14:37] ericb2 (Pavel is away for yet one week )
[14:37] ericb2 PhilippL: yesss !
[14:38] ericb2 congratulations to all developpers who contributed, and let's go for aquavcl02 !
[14:39] sunrayjogi ericb2: ...ehm.... I am not a developer :-)
[14:40] ericb2 congratulations to all people (even not developers ) who contributed, and let's go for aquavcl02 !
[14:40] ericb2 sunrayjogi: excuse me :)
[14:41] ericb2 sunrayjogi: for me you are developer btw
[14:43] ericb2 next point ?
[14:43] shaunmcdonald sunrayjogi: tester help in the development of the software, therefore in a broad context testers are developers
[14:44] shaunmcdonald 3. aquavcl01 cws integration (part3)
[14:44] ismael_ other aqua news
[14:44] PhilippL well, it's almost there :-)
[14:45] ismael_ i made listboxes more aqua
[14:45] ericb2 ismael_: great !
[14:45] ericb2 ismael_: I read your long patch, and this a great work
[14:46] shaunmcdonald 4. aquafilepicker01 integration
[14:46] ismael_ i also reviewed my patch for aqua tabs and i plan to commit it, only the part of drawing of tabs not the part which replace several lines of tabs by a listbox
[14:47] PhilippL ismael_: +1
[14:47] ismael_ ericb2:yes it is a bit long as i modified a lots of parts of listboxes
[14:47] ismael_ i also made a patch for removing the bold text of focused tabs
[14:47] ericb2 ismael_: another thing you did, and I found very interesting, was how you solved the "bold" tab issue. Good work
[14:48] ismael_ but this patch concerns not only the macport but at least gnome ooo
[14:48] ismael_ so do i commit it only to aquavcl ?
[14:49] ericb2 PhilippL: what do you think for gnome part ?
[14:49] ismael_ although it may profit to other platforms?
[14:49] PhilippL ericb2: The gnome part is pretty localized and also an improvement, so I think its good.
[14:51] ericb2 ismael_: you can commit it, and if ever we discover something to change, we have the time with aquavcl02
[14:51] ismael_ ericb2: so i commit it to aquavcl02?
[14:52] ericb2 ismael_: yes
[14:52] ismael_ ericb2: ok
[14:52] ericb2 ismael_: aquavcl01 is closed, and nominated
[14:52] ismael_ ericb2: and what about for gnome?
[14:53] PhilippL ismael_: commit it to aquavcl02, also. If aquavcl02 doesn't make it into 2.3, then we can merge the change over to some other CWS.
[14:53] ismael_ PhilippL: ok
[14:55] ericb2 to close the point, I'll propose, for next meeting, or once Pavel will be back, to define clear objectives for aquavcl02
[14:59] PhilippL next point ?
[15:00] shaunmcdonald 4. aquafilepicker01 integration
[15:04] shaunmcdonald how is the integration progressing?
[15:04] ericb2 I think only Florian Heckl can answer. Currently they are open issues
[15:04] ericb2 I have no other information
[15:05] ericb2 according to EIS, aquafilepicker01 is in new state
[15:05] ericb2 Back to new - because of two crashes.
[15:05] ericb2 #i77843#
[15:05] shaunmcdonald ericb2: ok
[15:06] shaunmcdonald lets move on
[15:06] shaunmcdonald 5. development after aquavcl01
[15:06] IZBot porting DEFECT STARTED P2 OOo crashes upon clicking Finish in database wizard with Native File Picker http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/ show_bug.cgi?id=77843
[15:06] PhilippL I propose to begin Cocoa transition.
[15:06] * mod__ just wants to mention, that the good news was in German media, stating that the port is making huge progress
[15:06] shaunmcdonald mod__: great
[15:06] sunrayjogi PhilippL: You have fun with the Mac, haven't you? .-)
[15:06] PhilippL Anything we do now in carbon will need to be converted to cocoa else.
[15:06] ericb2 PhilippL: ok. Noticed
[15:08] hdu_hh I suggest to use aquavcl02 to make Aqua2.3 usable, then do the Cocoa transition
[15:08] ericb2 PhilippL: the most urgent is to define clearly what we do : wrap ObjC or use objc++ directly
[15:09] shaunmcdonald making ooo useable is most important
[15:09] ericb2 PhilippL: I think hdu_hh proposal is a good idea
[15:09] ericb2 PhilippL: and I'd vote for : start to define rules, but complete usability first
[15:09] shaunmcdonald later do the transition to cocoa, say in aquavcl03
[15:09] PhilippL me not. We'll have to postpone accessibility implementation then.
[15:10] PhilippL just to implement everthing again ?
[15:10] shaunmcdonald then thereafter, we can look into other things like scriptability
[15:10] sunrayjogi who will fix issue 79212
[15:10] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: anything new will be done in Cocoa
[15:10] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212
[15:10] PhilippL shaunmcdonald: Which will be exactly nothing unless we start to make cocoa useable.
[15:11] shaunmcdonald PhilippL: are we that far through the implementation already?
[15:11] ericb2 PhilippL: we have deep changes, starting with window, frame and events
[15:11] PhilippL ericb2: yes, exactly, and the longer we wait the worse the change gets.
[15:12] ericb2 PhilippL: can drag and drop we implemented without Cocoa. This is imho the only basic missing feature
[15:12] ericb2 ?
[15:13] ericb2 PhilippL: another question : will we manage .nib files ?
[15:13] * dave_largo (n=drichard@64-132-254-105.static.twtelecom.net) has joined #ooo_macport
[15:13] PhilippL ericb2: I don't think so. What would we do with tem ?
[15:13] hdu_hh ericb2: click on document => OOo opens the document would be a basic feature too
[15:13] ericb2 hdu_hh: does the attached patch work ?
[15:13] shaunmcdonald do we have a list of this is implemented, and this needs to be implemented in the future?
[15:14] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: that's waht I had in mind for newt meeting
[15:14] shaunmcdonald hdu_hh: I think that can be done without cocoa?
[15:14] ericb2 s/newt/newt/
[15:14] ericb2 next
[15:14] ericb2 oh
[15:14] hdu_hh the AppleEvents are a Carbon thing
[15:14] shaunmcdonald ericb2: then we can push each item into a aquavcl0X release
[15:15] shaunmcdonald hdu_hh: AppleEvents cannot be used in Cocoa?
[15:15] ericb2 hdu_hh: right
[15:15] hdu_hh shaunmacdonald: they probably can, but the APIs are documented in the Carbon section
[15:15] PhilippL just another thing that needs to be redone.
[15:16] hdu_hh maybe they'll deprecate them too sooner or later
[15:16] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: Apple often deprecate things, like processor types :-)
[15:16] ericb2 hdu_hh: unfortunaly , I think so
[15:17] sunrayjogi PhilippL: Is it possible to mix Cocoa and Carbon?
[15:17] >mod__< do you have link(s) for german press ?
[15:17] PhilippL sunrayjogi: yes.
[15:17] PhilippL sunrayjogi: or so says apple.
[15:17] sunrayjogi PhilippL: So we only have to define which part needs to be written in Cocoa... the rest can be used as it is?
[15:18] mav_eric Even without beeing a developer it seems reasonable to make the transistion to Cocoa early enough so that we don't have a final Carbon app needing to ported to Cocoa in full
[15:18] mav_eric sunrayjogi: yes. you can mix Cocoa and Carbon
[15:18] PhilippL sunrayjogi: The problem is that Carbon UI is deprecated nowadays.
[15:18] mav_eric sunrayjogi: it can be used but not in 64bit
[15:19] sunrayjogi PhilippL: I know
[15:19] mav_eric 64bit - is strictly cocoa and carbon will be frozen at the current stat
[15:19] mav_eric state
[15:19] mav_eric and more sooner than later vanish
[15:19] sunrayjogi mav_eric: I am very interested what M$ will do with their old Carbon app ....
[15:20] mav_eric sunrayjogi: i assume they rewrote parts of MSO 2008 in Cocoa
[15:20] ericb2 sunrayjogi: you can belive me : Microsfot has resources
[15:20] mav_eric they may have faced the same problem we're now facing but may have known earlier
[15:20] ericb2 sunrayjogi: 180 developers are working for the next Mac Office version
[15:20] mav_eric ok. were just 178 behind :-)
[15:21] ExLachs sunrayjogi, issue 79212 has a patch attached. can someone try it?
[15:21] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212
[15:21] ericb2 Can we define priorities ?
[15:23] mav_eric my proposal: 1. new features - Cocoa only
[15:23] mav_eric 2. move old deprecated carbon to Cocoa
[15:24] ismael_ FYI, mikesic is working on a cocoa spellchecker
[15:24] mav_eric 3. if necessary features freeze until the move to Cocoa is done
[15:24] ismael_ so "cocoa transition" has already started in a certain way
[15:24] hdu_hh mav_eric: 4. have a usable AquaOOo 2.3
[15:24] * ericb2 proposes something different : 1) what is needed
[15:25] mav_eric hdu_hh: could be a nice side effect :-)
[15:25] ericb2 1) define a limit for current port
[15:25] PhilippL mav_eric: Some things will not be moved to Cocoa since they do not exist there example: HITheme API. But I think there shouldn't be many more.
[15:25] mav_eric PhilippL: so this needs to be redone in Cocoa once Carbon is "gone"
[15:25] * shaunmcdonald hopes the new spell checker will be better than the Mac OS X spell checker, which removes the underline when you are editing a mis-spelled word
[15:25] ericb2 PhilippL: we have code for HIView ( at least we don't start from scratch)
[15:26] PhilippL mav_eric: There are two possibilities: 1. Apple implements a theme API for Cocoa, too ( a radar issue exists for that )
[15:26] PhilippL mav_eric: Or 2), we switch our UI to native Cocoa controls (actually to native controls on all platforms). This however would be a long, evolutinary migration process.
[15:27] ericb2 PhilippL: about HITheme, my sources told me : No ( but maybe my sources are not good .. )
[15:27] mav_eric PhilippL: O.k. so some things need to stay carbon while the long evolution is gone?
[15:27] ismael_ shaunmcdonald: it will be the native mac os spellchecker
[15:27] PhilippL mav_eric: yes.
[15:28] * Fridrich has quit (Remote closed the connection)
[15:28] PhilippL mav_eric: However our AquaSalFrame should move to Cocoa so the Accessibilty implementation can base on that.
[15:28] mav_eric PhilippL: O.K. this even sounds to me as a no coder good
[15:28] * Fridrich (n=fridrich@137.137.62.81.cust.bluewin.ch) has joined #ooo_macport
[15:28] * ChanServ gives channel operator status to Fridrich
[15:28] ericb2 FYI, what is currently missing :
[15:28] ericb2 drag and drop
[15:28] ericb2 resolution issues
[15:28] ericb2 click on document => OOo opens the document
[15:28] ericb2 native filepicker
[15:28] ericb2 add more Aqua look
[15:29] ericb2 this list could close the first aqua implementation, (and close aquavcl02)
[15:29] PhilippL ericb2: multi display support, plugins, applets, tons of stuff ;-)
[15:29] ericb2 PhilippL: later
[15:29] ericb2 PhilippL: whith my list, 90% of people (maybe more), are happy
[15:30] mav_eric PhilippL: ericb2 is right. First we need to cover the 10% of the basic features mosten used
[15:30] PhilippL We don't reach beta quality until we are feature complete.
[15:31] shaunmcdonald muti display is important for presentations
[15:31] PhilippL That's basically the defintion of beta.
[15:31] * shaunmcdonald thought applets within ooo had been disabled a long time ago due to security
[15:31] PhilippL However you are of course right, that aquavcl02 should not be feature complete yet.
[15:31] * divoe_ (n=divoe01@dslc-082-082-130-193.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #ooo_macport
[15:31] mav_eric PhilippL: so you want an "old school" beta?
[15:32] PhilippL mav_eric: I wouldn't call what we have now or after aquavcl02 a "beta"
[15:32] mav_eric PhilippL: agreed
[15:32] ericb2 PhilippL: aquavcl0" can be created now if you want, and in parallel, becaue experimental. and if ever progress are fast, we could modify our timeline
[15:32] PhilippL mav_eric: A beta should basically be reached when OOo 3.0 gets "beta", which is somewhen next year ?
[15:32] mav_eric PhilippL: yes. There is a wiki page about this.
[15:33] * ericb2 meant aquavlc03 could be created
[15:33] shaunmcdonald a plugin for web browsers would be good as linux and windows has that
[15:33] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: later, this is gadget
[15:33] shaunmcdonald the beta for ooo 3.0 is the start of next year
[15:33] ericb2 shaunmcdonald: compared to drag and drop
[15:33] shaunmcdonald ericb2: of course, it is on a "later" list
[15:34] ericb2 Can we summarize ?
[15:34] * obr thinks webbrowser plugin should be done with xslt transforms (also on other platforms)
[15:34] shaunmcdonald ooo 2.0 feature freeze is march 2008 http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/OOoRelease30
[15:35] shaunmcdonald s/ooo 2.0/ooo 3.0
[15:37] ericb2 I propose :
[15:37] ericb2 Aquavcl02 objectives :
[15:37] ericb2 Achieve first Aqua version
[15:37] ericb2 drag and drop
[15:37] ericb2 resolution issues
[15:37] ericb2 click on document => OOo opens the document
[15:37] ericb2 native filepicker
[15:37] ericb2 add more Aqua look
[15:37] ericb2 Aquavcl03 :
[15:37] ericb2 Start Cocoa migration
[15:37] ericb2 Opinions ?
[15:38] PhilippL ok, let's do that
[15:38] ericb2 both cws can start today
[15:38] ericb2 +1 for me
[15:38] PhilippL aquavcl02 is running already.
[15:38] hdu_hh +1 from me too
[15:39] ericb2 PhilippL: yes :)
[15:39] ericb2 of course, other issues fixd in meantime are welcome :)
[15:40] * shaunmcdonald wonders what happens with changes in 1 CWS affecting/causing conflict with the other
[15:40] * sunrayjogi will like it to see the old "interface builder" from NeXT again ;-)
[15:41] mav_eric sunrayjogi: doesn't it kind of still exist in the Interface Builder?
[15:41] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: issue 79212 has a patch - could you add it to aquavcl02?
[15:41] ericb2 Next point ?
[15:41] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212
[15:42] sunrayjogi mav_eric: ?
[15:42] mav_eric sunrayjogi: With the developer tools there is an app called "Interface Builder" installed
[15:42] sunrayjogi sunrayjogi: yes, it makes no sense to use it in carbon AFAIK; Its for Cocoa apps
[15:43] hdu_hh ericb2: will do
[15:43] sunrayjogi mav_eric: we're on the way to Cocoa, so maybe it will make sense to have a look at it - after many years of abstinence
[15:43] shaunmcdonald 6. testtool and its packaging in the application bundle
[15:43] * sunrayjogi has started with NEXTSTEP
[15:43] mav_eric sunrayjogi: That's a descision to be made by the devs and they seem to favour other ways
[15:44] mav_eric decission
[15:44] * divoe has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
[15:45] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: will do
[15:45] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: fine... on friday I will have self-made schoko crossies for my devs :-) (if my daughter won't eat them all)
[15:46] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: mmmh :-)
[15:46] sunrayjogi mav_eric: we will see... I haven't seen a GUI designer for VCL....
[15:46] mav_eric sunrayjogi: I once was able to modify and existing GUI and it was pretty self explaining
[15:46] ericb2 Next point ? :-)
[15:46] mav_eric sunrayjogi: we should get rid of vcl ;-)
[15:47] PhilippL sunrayjogi: I wouldn't bereave your daughter of chocolate :-)
[15:47] hdu_hh mav_eric: where is the patch?
[15:47] ericb2 hdu_hh: ;)
[15:47] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: -> ask Gregor
[15:47] sunrayjogi ExLachs: PATCH?
[15:47] mav_eric hdu_hh: no idea?
[15:48] hdu_hh mav_eric: the patch to replace vcl with something better ;-)
[15:48] shaunmcdonald 6. testtool and its packaging in the application bundle
[15:48] mav_eric hdu_hh: hmm. Nowhere.
[15:49] sunrayjogi hdu_hh: see attachment from gh - there is the patch
[15:49] ExLachs sunrayjogi, second attachment to issue 79212
[15:49] sunrayjogi ExLachs: jaja ;-)
[15:49] hdu_hh sunrayjogi: ok
[15:49] IZBot porting PATCH NEW P3 testtool crashes with native aqua menues http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=79212
[15:49] sunrayjogi shaunmcdonald: is it important?
[15:49] ExLachs but I couldn't try it so first test please
[15:49] sunrayjogi shaunmcdonald: There is a need for us that it can be run.
[15:50] <shaunmcdonald> sunrayjogi: it doesn't matter if testtool uses native aqua menus
[15:50] <sunrayjogi> hdu_hh: you have read Gregors words ? TEST ... :-)
[15:50] * cloph_away is now known as cloph
[15:50] <shaunmcdonald> sunrayjogi: in theory we could disable them for testtool
[15:51] <sunrayjogi> shaunmcdonald: I did so. I do not want that.
[15:51] <ExLachs> sunrayjogi, hdu_hh have to go now
[15:51] <shaunmcdonald> sunrayjogi: I mean disable at compile time
[15:51] <sunrayjogi> shaunmcdonald: I would like to test what we will see and not something special...
[15:52] <sunrayjogi> hdu_hh: on OOO hdu in IZ?
[15:52] <shaunmcdonald> sunrayjogi: is it just testtool that has the problem, or is it the full ooo too?
[15:52] <hdu_hh> sunrayjogi: yes
[15:52] <ExLachs> it seem as it the livemenu tries to read the appmenu which is updated by the currently displayed document. This happens while the document is still in corntructor this it fails.
[15:52] <sunrayjogi> shaunmcdonald: -> ask the creator of TT not me (ExLachs)
[15:53] * shaunmcdonald currently thinks it is just the testtool app that has the problem and not the main ooo app when running tests
[15:53] * shaunmcdonald hasn't worked with the aqua testtool yet
[15:53] <ExLachs> seems to be TT only, but sunrayjogi should know about OOo. just reset the env variable before starting OOo and you will see.
[15:54] <sunrayjogi> ExLachs: I will give it a try
[15:55] <ExLachs> ok gone now!!
[15:55] <hdu_hh> ExLachs: bye!
[15:55] <sunrayjogi> ExLachs: cul8er