ReleaseStatus Minutes 2008-12-08 IRC log

From Apache OpenOffice Wiki
Jump to: navigation, search

(14:58:06) kai_a [n=Kai_Ahre@i577AA450.versanet.de] hat den Raum betreten.
(14:59:00) sophi [n=sophie@123.210-65-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] hat den Raum betreten.
(15:00:10) _Nesshof_: moin
(15:00:18) ja_: Moin
(15:00:35) UweL [n=chatzill@nat/sun/x-c83332f7f3bc4d53] hat den Raum betreten.
(15:00:51) MechtiIde: moin moin
(15:00:54) volkerme [n=chatzill@62.80.1.130] hat den Raum betreten.
(15:01:11) stefan_b: Moin moin!
(15:01:20) volkerme: Moin
(15:01:46) _Nesshof_: let's start with 3.0.1 status
(15:01:57) _Nesshof_: code freeze is this week
(15:02:16) _Nesshof_: there are still around 50 ! issues open with that target
(15:02:27) _Nesshof_: do we think we are still on track ?
(15:02:37) UweL: hardly
(15:04:42) _Nesshof_: I would like to have an rc1 out before the xmas break
(15:05:45) _Nesshof_: ja_: whats the latest date we than have for the upload ?
(15:05:47) MechtiIde: do we get a milestone after coode freeze before RC1?
(15:06:02) UweL: me too, when is this break?
(15:06:36) _Nesshof_: MechtiIde: it depends, my hope whould be that the next build already is the rc
(15:06:42) ja_: _Nesshof_: For me it would be end of this week. For Marcus it would be the week after.
(15:07:28) _Nesshof_: ja_: that means ca. December 18th
(15:07:58) UweL: do we have to vote for the break?  :-)
(15:08:01) ja_: _Nesshof_: it would be December 19th for Marcus
(15:09:08) _Nesshof_: so we should have all open cws integrated until December 15 to get build and upload done with some included buffer time
(15:09:19) _Nesshof_: that might work
(15:09:46) _Nesshof_: btw, I will not be available for the next 4 weeks
(15:09:56) rtimm: lucky you
(15:10:02) ja_: _Nesshof_: as we already have automated most of the copy jobs it shouldn't take too much time for an upload by Marcus.
(15:10:05) _Nesshof_: :-)
(15:10:28) rtimm: Yes, havin them integrated by December 15 sounds good.
(15:10:41) _Nesshof_: ja_: ok, this might give us an extra day of buffer
(15:10:59) _Nesshof_: any other issues around the 3.0.1 release ?
(15:11:16) UweL: we have 2 open stopper
(15:11:53) UweL: issue 96938
(15:12:02) IZBot: framework DEFECT NEW P2 Basic library is lost when saving after network interrupt http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=96938
(15:12:27) UweL: issue 86509
(15:12:32) IZBot: tools DEFECT NEW P3 testshl2: Need to move to external http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=86509
(15:13:00) UweL: I do not know the second one
(15:13:29) _rene_: I just reopened it a few mins ago, it was already a blocker in 3.0
(15:13:36) _rene_: and it's not fixed :)
(15:13:40) rtimm: doesn't look like a real stopper for this bug fix release, I think
(15:13:57) UweL: me too
(15:14:31) _rene_: I don't mind, I know you don't care about proper external/non-external split
(15:14:44) _rene_: I just marked it as stopper because it was one for 3.0
(15:15:36) _rene_: _Nesshof_: if you want a rc1 before x-mas break
(15:15:37) _Nesshof_: grmmpf, my hope that this issue has been cared of properly, kai_a we really need to fix this
(15:15:46) _rene_: _Nesshof_: why (the f...) don't we have m13 yet?
(15:16:27) _Nesshof_: rtimm: do you know about m13 ?
(15:16:28) _rene_: _Nesshof_: was started mid of last week, even m38 was before it (and 3.1 stuff is far away(tm) in contrast to m13)
(15:16:28) rtimm: Ivo had some difficulties with it. Still working on
(15:18:31) _Nesshof_: rtimm: do you know about an estimation for being ready ?
(15:18:32) _rene_: _Nesshof_: yeah, and also the reportbuilder thing, which is STILL not in DEV300
(15:19:10) _rene_: _Nesshof_: but "of course", kai_a doesn't even answer on questions about WHERE and WHEN this should be done
(15:19:11) _Nesshof_: kai_a: do you have a status about the separation of report extension for an own module
(15:19:57) _rene_: I even would do it myself, but given the svn mv problematics...
(15:20:22) rtimm: _Nesshof_: I already estimatied something on thursday, was terrible wrong :-(
(15:20:35) _Nesshof_: rtimm: maybe this is job where RE can give some support
(15:20:41) rtimm: Updated estimate: last install sets ready in about an hour.
(15:20:50) kai_a: _rene_: same to me, but we're still on track as an internal bugfix CWS, I think...
(15:21:01) _rene_: then f... do it
(15:21:10) _rene_: there's configure changes relying on it
(15:21:15) _rene_: outside builders rely on it
(15:21:21) rtimm: _Nesshof_: then tagging and some more - this evening?
(15:21:31) kai_a: _rene_: will use the whole fist!!!
(15:22:11) _rene_: kai_a: really, it's now months
(15:22:12) rtimm: _Nesshof_: I am against moving things around for 3.0.1. What shall this be good for?
(15:22:26) _rene_: kai_a: and anyone packaging thr SRB relies on the configure behaviour of OOO300
(15:22:35) _Nesshof_: rtimm: we are already talking about 3.1
(15:22:35) _rene_: kai_a: -> boom in DEV300
(15:22:54) rtimm: _Nesshof_: really?
(15:23:01) kai_a: _rene_: I know, sorry the heavy delay. Ok? Will doit for 3.1
(15:23:04) _Nesshof_: rtimm: yes
(15:23:07) rtimm: OK
(15:23:15) _rene_: kai_a: 3.1 is not a enough answer to me.
(15:23:27) _rene_: kai_a: I know that it needs happening for 3.1
(15:23:34) _rene_: kai_a: that doesn't tell me when and in which cws
(15:23:38) rtimm: _Nesshof_: Than I haven't got you in where RE should help ...
(15:23:43) _rene_: remember: I need to do configure changes
(15:24:00) _rene_: kai_a: and only be able to build sane packages at the last minute is not good(tm) either
(15:24:00) _Nesshof_: rtimm: with moving files
(15:24:17) kai_a: _rene_: ok to make it fix: would next week be ok for you?
(15:24:36) _Nesshof_: UweL: are we on track with the UI/Feature freeze date for 3.1 ?
(15:24:50) _rene_: kai_a: if you mean integration: yes :)
(15:24:56) _rene_: kai_a: and monday :)
(15:24:59) _rene_: means: asap.
(15:25:26) _rene_: sorry, but I am fed up waiting
(15:25:31) kai_a: _rene_: asap seems better, having a family to take care of at the weekends
(15:25:34) _rene_: without answer
(15:25:44) _rene_: kai_a: no argument
(15:25:55) _rene_: kai_a: svn mv foobar somedir is not much work
(15:26:04) _Nesshof_: _rene_: kai_a: enough said, we know about the prio
(15:26:37) _Nesshof_: UweL: ?
(15:26:37) _rene_: _Nesshof_: ah, a propos prio: writer2latexexternal. can you please get mba to remember what we actually talked about in HH? ;-)
(15:26:46) UweL: _Nesshof_:not enough features in QA
(15:27:02) _Nesshof_: _rene_: yes
(15:27:30) _Nesshof_: UweL: ok, we need to hurry up a bit with preparing those cws for QA
(15:28:27) _Nesshof_: funny, still 800 issues on target 3.1
(15:29:05) stefan_b: _Nesshof_, easy to do until Christmas 2009... :-)
(15:29:17) _rene_: _Nesshof_: and I DO NOT LIKE having to file a dummy issue when the cws description CLEARLY says what has been done
(15:29:40) rtimm: _Nesshof_: I like your sense of humor
(15:30:05) _rene_: _Nesshof_: are you surprised? /me not at all
(15:31:31) _Nesshof_: _rene_: I don't know the sarcasm/irony emticon
(15:31:38) rtimm: so, what is our conclusion? Any suggestion?
(15:32:39) _Nesshof_: rtimm: delete issuetracker database :-)
(15:33:17) _Nesshof_: anyone having a better idea ;-)
(15:33:32) stefan_b: selling bugfixes
(15:33:50) _Nesshof_: stefan_b: selling or buying ?
(15:34:24) stefan_b: both. otherwise we'd be accused of having issues on purpose.
(15:35:14) _Nesshof_: what about moving all 3.1 issues to 3.2 and let people escalate here, to get them into 3.1 ?
(15:35:25) _rene_: that's senseless
(15:35:29) ***_Nesshof_ is serious again
(15:35:31) ja_: _Nesshof_: how about having a top10 discussion to cut the number of 3.1 issues down to a minimum ?
(15:35:33) ***_rene_ too
(15:35:46) _rene_: for features - yes
(15:36:04) _rene_: for bugfixes or buildfixes which are caused by Sun not even thinking about the community - no
(15:36:51) ***_Nesshof_ agrees on buildfixes
(15:37:01) volkerme: We always moved issues when the time ran out
(15:37:05) _Nesshof_: other bugfixes by review
(15:37:29) _rene_: yeah, right, let's do it like 3.0.1 where if I didn't do the cws pyUNO would be completely broken still in 3.0.1
(15:37:50) _rene_: or other important regressions
(15:38:06) _Nesshof_: _rene_: also agreed on those
(15:38:12) _rene_: but I am now aware that you don't care about fixing bugs so that you ship a good release
(15:38:22) _rene_: _Nesshof_: then don't propose moving bugfixes to 3.1
(15:38:37) _rene_: _Nesshof_: that only will cause some Sunnies not doing them
(15:38:52) _rene_: _Nesshof_: or community people motivated
(15:39:08) _rene_: such behaviour is *exactly* one of the reasons distros use ooo-build
(15:39:27) _rene_: because we cannot rely on OOo having bugs fixed when we need to release the distro :)
(15:39:39) rtimm: _rene_: if we do not move anything we'll ship 3.1 at the time we planned for 3.2. Not better, I think
(15:39:50) rtimm: We cannot create developers
(15:39:54) rtimm: Can you?
(15:40:14) _Nesshof_: _rene_: I disagree, if a fix is needed and available we will integrate them in every case within the given timelines
(15:40:16) _rene_: rtimm: but you can concentrate on bugfixes and not add features :)
(15:40:22) _rene_: _Nesshof_: HAHA
(15:40:27) _rene_: _Nesshof_: good joke
(15:40:50) _rene_: _Nesshof_: if I didn't do pyunoregressions301 it would have NOT go into 3.0.1. just as an exampel
(15:41:27) _Nesshof_: but now the fix is there and gets integrated
(15:41:27) _rene_: _Nesshof_: and I am sure I will find many more, some of them even at "requirements"
(15:41:40) _rene_: _Nesshof_: yes, but you claimed you (= Sun) would fix such bugs
(15:41:48) _rene_: _Nesshof_: this demonstratively was not true
(15:41:55) _Nesshof_: _rene_: I can't force anybody, neither a Sun person or non Sun person to fix a certain issue
(15:42:00) _rene_: _Nesshof_: you only fixed it for 3.1 without ANY plan for 3.0.1
(15:42:53) _rene_: (fwiw, I only fixed unix, not windows, but...)
(15:43:01) _Nesshof_: _rene_: I'm just claiming that I would like those bugs fixed, and if the were introduced by a certain person, this person should be responsible to fix the regression (independent of being Sun or not)
(15:43:06) SimonAW hat den Raum verlassen (quit: Read error: 113 (No route to host)).
(15:43:12) _rene_: _Nesshof_: correct. that didn't happen here.
(15:43:22) _rene_: _Nesshof_: jbu refused to do so and sb only did 3.1. wed :)
(15:43:25) _rene_: eh, qed :)
(15:43:54) UweL: I leave this one man show, bye. This is no release meeting anymore :-(
(15:44:01) UweL hat den Raum verlassen (quit: "ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0/2008052906]").
(15:45:04) _Nesshof_: _rene_: you're right in this case, this should not be, I will investigate in this
(15:49:43) ja_: Anything else ?
(15:50:17) _rene_: _Nesshof_: and exactly such things is as I said above a reason *for* ooo-build/go-oo
(15:50:21) _rene_: _Nesshof_: we can just fix it :)
(15:50:40) _rene_: without relying on you (= Sun) to fix it *somewhen*
(15:51:22) _rene_: ja_: yes, someone please get UweL to actually care about quality of releases. if he did, he would have stayed ;-)
(15:53:32) stefan_b: Shall we start a discussion about "What is Quality" now? I could contribute A LOT to that....
(15:53:47) _Nesshof_: _rene_: ok, that whz we are talking here about such issues
(15:53:53) stefan_b: Summarized: A matter of point of view.
(15:54:02) ja_: _rene_ what do you think Sun QA in Hamburg is doing the whole day ?
(15:54:12) stefan_b: However, it there is QA-relevant contents coming upp, I will tell Uwe about it.
(15:54:30) _rene_: I won't say that, I would be accused of trolling. But sometimnes it's not QA, no :)
(15:55:03) _rene_: stefan_b: see above. the discussion *was* QA-relevant?=
(15:55:14) _Nesshof_: ok, any other issue around 3.1 ?
(15:55:27) _rene_: stefan_b: or *do* you or uwel want to releasse a 3.0.1 without a trivial fix which fixes a regression caused by 3.0?
(15:55:51) stefan_b: _rene_, good news: this is tracked so that ALL can read things worth to know as well as "filled lines" of humor and such .
(15:55:55) _rene_: stefan_b: a HUGHE regression (pyuno essentially being broken, no user scripts and no python extensions)
(15:56:16) _rene_: stefan_b: and I didn't even fix windows there, from what I see in sb101 windows have even more problems :)
(15:56:43) _Nesshof_: rtimm: RE duties ?
(15:57:08) _rene_: stefan_b: I know this channel is logged. it it wouldn't by you, all channels and queries I are in are logged anyway ;-)
(15:57:09) rtimm: Kurt (kz) will do OOO300 this week, me (rt) DEV300
(15:58:27) stefan_b: _rene_, yeas, but your comment from March 16, 2007 at 23:44 did not exactly please me. Have a look... :-)
(15:58:48) stefan_b: har har, just kidding.
(16:03:32) rtimm: anything open for today?
(16:04:25) ja_: not that I know about
(16:04:28) rtimm: 3 - 2 - 1 - - - gone
(16:04:31) rtimm hat den Raum verlassen
(16:04:32) _Nesshof_: ok, anzthing else for today ?
(16:04:43) _Nesshof_: ok, by
(16:05:20) ja_: bye bye

Personal tools