Renaissance:Status Meetings:2009-05-25

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Meeting Details

• 2009-05-25, 4:00 PM CET
• IRC details: irc.freenode.net #ux.openoffice.org

In Attendance

• Andreas Bartel (IRC: Andreas)
• Frank Loehmann (IRC: FrankL)
• Christoph Lukasiak (IRC: clu_sun)
• Christoph Noack (IRC: christoph_n)

Agenda Items

• Review of old action items
• Round Table

Action Items

Date	Description	Owner	Status
2009-01-19/4	Compatitive Analysis	none	Stalled

Comments on Action Items

- Competitive analysis will be conducted by community member(s). Analysis will be based on findings from our user surveys. It is important that we get first insights as soon as possible in order to use them for prototyping.

Round Table

• Christoph N. wants to collect feedback from proposal submitters about the idea collection process.
• Frank L. has posted new results from the User Survey 2009
• Andreas B. will blog about next steps and ideation methods/results done last week.

IRC Log

== IRC Log ==
Andreas: hi everyone
[16:02] Andreas: we are just waiting for martin to show up.
[16:03] clu_sun: moin
[16:03] Andreas: don't know if he will make it today
[16:03] christoph_n: hi there
[16:04] FrankL: Hi!
[16:08] Andreas: it seems that Martin is not here today
[16:08] Andreas: so lets start anyway
[16:09] Andreas: Frank is currently updating the project tasks
[16:11] Andreas: a few days before someone asked on the mailing list to codunct the competitive analysis
[16:12] christoph_n: Yes, I told him that it might be beneficial to wait for what is required. Do we know? 
[16:12] Andreas: i think Jaron was the one, correct me if i am wrong. was there anyone else?
[16:12] Andreas: ok christioph, do you know who that was?
[16:12] christoph_n: (still searching)
[16:12] christoph_n: Miroslav
[16:12] Andreas: ok
[16:13] Andreas: one interesting question in that context would be to find out if and where competitive offering are more efficient then we are
[16:14] Andreas: sorry, than we are
[16:14] christoph_n: Is this possible by just looking at it? Do we need common tasks, e.g. based on the survey results or user feedback?
[16:15] christoph_n: What was planned, originally?
[16:15] Andreas: I guess it would require both
[16:16] Andreas: e.g. creating a professionally looking presentation and a photo album
[16:16] Andreas: inserting and handling images and tables
[16:16] Andreas: all the basics
[16:16] Andreas: however, exploration would also be necessary
[16:17] Andreas: Miroslav might also add something
[16:18] christoph_n: So how to proceed? I think a general answer to the list (and Miroslav) is a first step. So do we agree on basic tasks in presentation software?
[16:18] christoph_n: Or do we also address the other OpenOffice.org/SO modules?
[16:19] Andreas: no
[16:19] Andreas: important thing is that if we want to benefit from that analysis, first insight must be available as soon as possible
[16:20] Andreas: otherwise we won't be able to use the findings during prototyping
[16:20] Andreas: Impress module first since we deal with it right now
[16:20] christoph_n: Okay, is there a realistic chance to get some results based on the user feedback? E.g. the top 50 of features which might give a clue what the user really does?
[16:22] Andreas: quite difficult currently because we have some problems assigning the source of functional calls e.g. was CTRL-S pressed in Calc or Impress
[16:22] Andreas: in addition, usage feedback extension won't tell you much about the tasks users try to do.
[16:23] christoph_n: Okay, so we have to develop a list based on our experience?
[16:23] Andreas: a lot is avaible from the last user survey
[16:23] Andreas: I have a list of 250 pages with user feedback from users who use Impress 
[16:23] Andreas: I guess a close look at that data would reveal a lot
[16:24] Andreas: if we concentrate at their activities and experiences
[16:24] christoph_n: As far as I understand: replay to the list, consider asic tasks in Impress, based on the user survey data (comments), asap 
[16:24] christoph_n: sorry: replay --> reply
[16:24] Andreas: correct
[16:24] christoph_n: ouch: asic --> basic
[16:25] FrankL: BTW the OOo User Survey 2009 data based on >125k users  is available too.
[16:26] FrankL: Link: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Renaissance:Phase_1:OOoUser_Survey2009
[16:26] christoph_n: Documentation in the Wiki? How about a visual walkthrough to be as objective as possible (may be enhanced by a "experience" summary).
[16:27] Andreas: visual walkthrough???
[16:27] christoph_n: Screenshots which reveal each step.
[16:28] Andreas: if that anwsers the question if and where competition is better
[16:28] christoph_n: Andreas, who will answer? (As always, this is a rather rhetorical question.)
[16:29] Andreas: the competitive analysis
[16:29] christoph_n: I meant the person replying to Miroslav. I'll do that, okay? The rest of the discussion should be on the list (in my opinion).
[16:30] Andreas: ok
[16:31] christoph_n: Next item?
[16:31] Andreas: we have the proposals "evaluation" which is basically giving feedback to interesting or maybe unclear ideas
[16:32] Andreas: i guess that this is almost done.
[16:32] Andreas: since the deadline was today, anyway.
[16:33] christoph_n: Yep. Johannes asked if it will be possible to continue the work on the proposals.
[16:33] Andreas: well of course. but i have to ask with which gaol?
[16:33] Andreas: sorry goal
[16:34] Andreas: what should be the outcome of further steps?
[16:34] christoph_n: He thinks it's not finished yet. Yesterday, I replied that he might work on that, but the key ideas are already there.
[16:34] Andreas: what is finished, how do you define finished?
[16:34] christoph_n: Concerning the outcome, it seems that the next step isn't too well described at the moment.
[16:35] Andreas: and what do we gain if everyone if "finished"?
[16:35] christoph_n: finished (from what I understand) --> personally satisfied with the outcome
[16:35] Andreas: I agree, at least it is not that clearly described online
[16:35] christoph_n: I propose to make it more clear in the summarizing blog post, we discussed earlier.
[16:35] Andreas: however, we have a project plan which also described what was attempted to do in the design phase
[16:36] Andreas: unfortunately we jumped right into the last step of the phase, but however, that where we actually are
[16:37] Andreas: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Renaissance:Phase_"
[16:37] Andreas: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Renaissance:Phase_2
[16:37] Andreas: sorry
[16:39] christoph_n: Back to the question. It's important that the ideas are available in a sufficient quality (quality = understandability). I think this goal is (more than) reached for most of the proposals. So the next step is the summary?
[16:39] Andreas: sure, I guess that would be a nice blog entry
[16:40] Andreas: by the way  ideation is about quanitity not quality 
[16:40] Andreas: again, something I learned in Berlin and I pretty much get the point and agree now
[16:40] christoph_n: Oh, then I missed the approach 
[16:41] Andreas: ok, so what's next.
[16:41] Andreas: the blog entry
[16:42] Andreas: summarizing commonalities and maybe differences among the proposals
[16:42] christoph_n: And I would like to ask the authors to clean up the proposals (e.g. removing the gray explanatory text, updating the status).
[16:42] Andreas: ok
[16:42] Andreas: Liz is on vacation today, correct?
[16:42] FrankL: Yes.
[16:44] Andreas: Liz was going to do the summary right?
[16:44] Andreas: so we have a new action item 1
[16:44] Andreas: I am going to blog about what's currently going on and what we plan to do next
[16:44] christoph_n: --> Andreas: Great!
[16:45] Andreas: we did some experimental ideation last week with people with many different backgrounds
[16:45] Andreas: I'd like to share that experience and the outcomes we genereted
[16:45] Andreas: quite cool actaully
[16:46] Andreas: I guess I am done then for today
[16:47] Andreas: so action item 2 is mine
[16:48] christoph_n: Another question by me: I would like to ask the authors for some feedback - what worked well, what not? I would like to ask on the mailing list. Any ideas? Should this be delayed for some reason?
[16:48] christoph_n: Goal: To better know how to organize the ideas collection for the next steps...
[16:48] Andreas: you go go!
[16:48] Andreas: and may I give an advice?
[16:49] christoph_n: ... I asked for it. 
[16:49] Andreas: ok, you should be very clear this time what IDEAS COLLECTION actually is OR what we/you want it to be and FOR WHAT PURPOSE
[16:50] Andreas: I guess we could have done it better
[16:50] FrankL: but we have done it 
[16:51] christoph_n: ... I don't know what you mean. Is it about the additional ideas which have been proposed (apart from accessing functionality??
[16:51] Andreas: don't know, is it 
[16:52] Andreas: every type of a proposal has its role
[16:52] christoph_n: Okay, I will ask on the list. It has to be summed up anyway.
[16:52] Andreas: however, if all depends on what is currently the focus
[16:53] Andreas: so another action item for christoph ? 
[16:54] christoph_n: AC for Christoph: Do the ACs mentioned for Christoph.
[16:54] christoph_n:
[16:54] christoph_n: AC --> AI (it seems that I does not always mean intelligence)
[16:55] christoph_n: That's all at the moment. Anybody else?
[16:55] FrankL: We had  some more PR in May about Project Renaissance: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Renaissance:Press_Coverage
[16:55] christoph_n: Wow, I should check this page more often...
[16:56] Andreas: in deed 
[16:57] Andreas: ok, stick a fork in me, I'm done
[16:57] FrankL: Me too 
[16:57] FrankL wurde von ChanServ zum Operator gemacht.
[16:58] christoph_n: Bye (if there nothing else...)!
[16:58] FrankL: Bye!
[16:58] Andreas: same. Talk to you next week!
[16:58] Andreas: Ciao
== IRC Log ==