Renaissance:Status Meetings:2009-05-25

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Meeting Details

• 2009-05-18, 4:00 PM CET
• IRC details: irc.freenode.net #ux.openoffice.org

In Attendance

• Andreas Bartel (IRC: Andreas)
• Elizabeth Matthis (IRC: lizm)
• Frank Loehmann
• Christoph Lukasiak
• aknoxy
• taiebot65

Agenda Items

• Review of old action items
• Round Table

Action Items

Date	Description	Owner	Status
2009-01-19/4	Compatitive Analysis	Frank	Stalled

Comments on Action Items

- no update today

IRC Log

== IRC Log ==
Andreas: hi everyone
[16:02] Andreas: we are just waiting for martin to show up.
[16:03] clu_sun: moin
[16:03] Andreas: don't know if he will make it today
[16:03] christoph_n: hi there
[16:04] FrankL: Hi!
[16:08] Andreas: it seems that Martin is not here today
[16:08] Andreas: so lets start anyway
[16:09] Andreas: Frank is currently updating the project tasks
[16:11] Andreas: a few days before someone asked on the mailing list to codunct the competitive analysis
[16:12] christoph_n: Yes, I told him that it might be beneficial to wait for what is required. Do we know? 
[16:12] Andreas: i think Jaron was the one, correct me if i am wrong. was there anyone else?
[16:12] Andreas: ok christioph, do you know who that was?
[16:12] christoph_n: (still searching)
[16:12] christoph_n: Miroslav
[16:12] Andreas: ok
[16:13] Andreas: one interesting question in that context would be to find out if and where competitive offering are more efficient then we are
[16:14] Andreas: sorry, than we are
[16:14] christoph_n: Is this possible by just looking at it? Do we need common tasks, e.g. based on the survey results or user feedback?
[16:15] christoph_n: What was planned, originally?
[16:15] Andreas: I guess it would require both
[16:16] Andreas: e.g. creating a professionally looking presentation and a photo album
[16:16] Andreas: inserting and handling images and tables
[16:16] Andreas: all the basics
[16:16] Andreas: however, exploration would also be necessary
[16:17] Andreas: Miroslav might also add something
[16:18] christoph_n: So how to proceed? I think a general answer to the list (and Miroslav) is a first step. So do we agree on basic tasks in presentation software?
[16:18] christoph_n: Or do we also address the other OpenOffice.org/SO modules?
[16:19] Andreas: no
[16:19] Andreas: important thing is that if we want to benefit from that analysis, first insight must be available as soon as possible
[16:20] Andreas: otherwise we won't be able to use the findings during prototyping
[16:20] Andreas: Impress module first since we deal with it right now
[16:20] christoph_n: Okay, is there a realistic chance to get some results based on the user feedback? E.g. the top 50 of features which might give a clue what the user really does?
[16:22] Andreas: quite difficult currently because we have some problems assigning the source of functional calls e.g. was CTRL-S pressed in Calc or Impress
[16:22] Andreas: in addition, usage feedback extension won't tell you much about the tasks users try to do.
[16:23] christoph_n: Okay, so we have to develop a list based on our experience?
[16:23] Andreas: a lot is avaible from the last user survey
[16:23] Andreas: I have a list of 250 pages with user feedback from users who use Impress 
[16:23] Andreas: I guess a close look at that data would reveal a lot
[16:24] Andreas: if we concentrate at their activities and experiences
[16:24] christoph_n: As far as I understand: replay to the list, consider asic tasks in Impress, based on the user survey data (comments), asap 
[16:24] christoph_n: sorry: replay --> reply
[16:24] Andreas: correct
[16:24] christoph_n: ouch: asic --> basic
[16:25] FrankL: BTW the OOo User Survey 2009 data based on >125k users  is available too.
[16:26] FrankL: Link: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Renaissance:Phase_1:OOoUser_Survey2009
[16:26] christoph_n: Documentation in the Wiki? How about a visual walkthrough to be as objective as possible (may be enhanced by a "experience" summary).
[16:27] Andreas: visual walkthrough???
[16:27] christoph_n: Screenshots which reveal each step.
[16:28] Andreas: if that anwsers the question if and where competition is better
[16:28] christoph_n: Andreas, who will answer? (As always, this is a rather rhetorical question.)
[16:29] Andreas: the competitive analysis
[16:29] christoph_n: I meant the person replying to Miroslav. I'll do that, okay? The rest of the discussion should be on the list (in my opinion).
[16:30] Andreas: ok
[16:31] christoph_n: Next item?
[16:31] Andreas: we have the proposals "evaluation" which is basically giving feedback to interesting or maybe unclear ideas
[16:32] Andreas: i guess that this is almost done.
[16:32] Andreas: since the deadline was today, anyway.
[16:33] christoph_n: Yep. Johannes asked if it will be possible to continue the work on the proposals.
[16:33] Andreas: well of course. but i have to ask with which gaol?
[16:33] Andreas: sorry goal
[16:34] Andreas: what should be the outcome of further steps?
[16:34] christoph_n: He thinks it's not finished yet. Yesterday, I replied that he might work on that, but the key ideas are already there.
[16:34] Andreas: what is finished, how do you define finished?
[16:34] christoph_n: Concerning the outcome, it seems that the next step isn't too well described at the moment.
[16:35] Andreas: and what do we gain if everyone if "finished"?
[16:35] christoph_n: finished (from what I understand) --> personally satisfied with the outcome
[16:35] Andreas: I agree, at least it is not that clearly described online
[16:35] christoph_n: I propose to make it more clear in the summarizing blog post, we discussed earlier.
[16:35] Andreas: however, we have a project plan which also described what was attempted to do in the design phase
[16:36] Andreas: unfortunately we jumped right into the last step of the phase, but however, that where we actually are
[16:37] Andreas: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Renaissance:Phase_"
[16:37] Andreas: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Renaissance:Phase_2
[16:37] Andreas: sorry
[16:39] christoph_n: Back to the question. It's important that the ideas are available in a sufficient quality (quality = understandability). I think this goal is (more than) reached for most of the proposals. So the next step is the summary?
[16:39] Andreas: sure, I guess that would be a nice blog entry
[16:40] Andreas: by the way  ideation is about quanitity not quality 
[16:40] Andreas: again, something I learned in Berlin and I pretty much get the point and agree now
[16:40] christoph_n: Oh, then I missed the approach 
[16:41] Andreas: ok, so what's next.
[16:41] Andreas: the blog entry
[16:42] Andreas: summarizing commonalities and maybe differences among the proposals
[16:42] christoph_n: And I would like to ask the authors to clean up the proposals (e.g. removing the gray explanatory text, updating the status).
[16:42] Andreas: ok
[16:42] Andreas: Liz is on vacation today, correct?
[16:42] FrankL: Yes.
[16:44] Andreas: Liz was going to do the summary right?
[16:44] Andreas: so we have a new action item 1
[16:44] Andreas: I am going to blog about what's currently going on and what we plan to do next
[16:44] christoph_n: --> Andreas: Great!
[16:45] Andreas: we did some experimental ideation last week with people with many different backgrounds
[16:45] Andreas: I'd like to share that experience and the outcomes we genereted
[16:45] Andreas: quite cool actaully
[16:46] Andreas: I guess I am done then for today
[16:47] Andreas: so action item 2 is mine
[16:48] christoph_n: Another question by me: I would like to ask the authors for some feedback - what worked well, what not? I would like to ask on the mailing list. Any ideas? Should this be delayed for some reason?
[16:48] christoph_n: Goal: To better know how to organize the ideas collection for the next steps...
[16:48] Andreas: you go go!
[16:48] Andreas: and may I give an advice?
[16:49] christoph_n: ... I asked for it. 
[16:49] Andreas: ok, you should be very clear this time what IDEAS COLLECTION actually is OR what we/you want it to be and FOR WHAT PURPOSE
[16:50] Andreas: I guess we could have done it better
[16:50] FrankL: but we have done it 
[16:51] christoph_n: ... I don't know what you mean. Is it about the additional ideas which have been proposed (apart from accessing functionality??
[16:51] Andreas: don't know, is it 
[16:52] Andreas: every type of a proposal has its role
[16:52] christoph_n: Okay, I will ask on the list. It has to be summed up anyway.
[16:52] Andreas: however, if all depends on what is currently the focus
[16:53] Andreas: so another action item for christoph ? 
[16:54] christoph_n: AC for Christoph: Do the ACs mentioned for Christoph.
[16:54] christoph_n:
[16:54] christoph_n: AC --> AI (it seems that I does not always mean intelligence)
[16:55] christoph_n: That's all at the moment. Anybody else?
[16:55] FrankL: We had  some more PR in May about Project Renaissance: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Renaissance:Press_Coverage
[16:55] christoph_n: Wow, I should check this page more often...
[16:56] Andreas: in deed 
[16:57] Andreas: ok, stick a fork in me, I'm done
[16:57] FrankL: Me too 
[16:57] FrankL wurde von ChanServ zum Operator gemacht.
[16:58] christoph_n: Bye (if there nothing else...)!
[16:58] FrankL: Bye!
[16:58] Andreas: same. Talk to you next week!
[16:58] Andreas: Ciao
== IRC Log ==