Difference between revisions of "Community Council Log 20100429"

From Apache OpenOffice Wiki
Jump to: navigation, search
 
Line 1: Line 1:
=== IRC Log 2010-06-10 ===
+
=== IRC Log 2010-04-29 ===
  
 
*Supposed start time: 18:30 UTC  
 
*Supposed start time: 18:30 UTC  
Line 7: Line 7:
 
== Attendees  ==
 
== Attendees  ==
  
*Cor Nouws (CorNouws)
+
*Christoph Noack (christoph_n)
 +
*Eike Rathke (erAck)  
 
*Matthias Huetsch (mhu)  
 
*Matthias Huetsch (mhu)  
 
*Louis Suárez-Potts (louis_to)  
 
*Louis Suárez-Potts (louis_to)  
 
*Stefan Taxhet (stx12)
 
*Stefan Taxhet (stx12)
*Charles-H. Schulz (southerncross)
 
*Olivier Hallot (olivierhallot)
 
*Jürgen Schmidt (jsc)
 
 
  
 
== Absent  ==
 
== Absent  ==
  
*Eike Rathke (erAck)
+
*Cor Nouws (holiday)  
*Christoph Noack (christoph_n)
+
*Charles-H. Schulz
 
+
*Olivier Hallot
+
 
*mystery candidate
 
*mystery candidate
  
 
== Log  ==
 
== Log  ==
<pre>[14:38:03] louis_to then meeting has begun
+
<pre>[14:47:00] * mhu thinks we should start
[14:38:09] louis_to the agenda is above linked
+
[14:47:12] louis_to we did
[14:38:25] louis_to http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council/Agenda
+
[14:47:27] louis_to all in favour of prior minutes?
[14:38:58] louis_to do we approve of prior minutes?
+
[14:47:48] louis_to oh---procedureal point: who is driving today's meeting? I can do it but is christoph_n wanting to?
[14:39:14] louis_to that's item 09
+
[14:48:09] christoph_n Louis, go on&nbsp;:-) I just updated the agenda page.
[14:39:17] louis_to 0, I mean
+
[14:48:26] christoph_n Although I have to admit that there is no real agenda of the last meeting ...
[14:39:36] louis_to silence = uyes
+
[14:48:36] louis_to okay, thanks
[14:39:41] louis_to yes, I mean (cannot type)
+
[14:48:47] louis_to so we approve; any objections, please indicate now or in the list
[14:40:07] louis_to so, on to AI responsible Louis refresh incubator and nlc proceses
+
[14:49:06] louis_to 1.&nbsp;: elections have taken place and results posted.k
[14:40:12] louis_to sttaus: in progress
+
[14:49:17] louis_to thanks to Stefan and the oithers for doing the work!
[14:40:45] louis_to #3: AI Martin, publicize the open slot at the start of the CC meetings
+
[14:49:33] louis_to especial thanks to Stefan, in fact, who served as commisaire
[14:40:59] louis_to MH is not part of the CC. who is able to report on this for him?
+
[14:50:00] stx12 no, that was christoph_n
[14:41:24] jsc i think i volunteered for this
+
[14:50:07] louis_to ah&nbsp;:-)
[14:41:41] mhu mh has sent email to day to discuss@council to remind us of the status of his proposal
+
[14:50:12] louis_to then my hat is off to you, tooi
[14:41:46] jsc i talked to Martin several times and he would like to tak care of it ....
+
[14:50:16] christoph_n&nbsp;;-)
[14:42:03] mhu s/to day/today/
+
[14:50:28] christoph_n However, can we "close" this AI? There is a follow-up...
[14:42:10] jsc yes, he send a mail today
+
[14:50:33] * mhu thinks, speaking of election results, we should welcome Eike, no&nbsp;?
[14:42:12] *** christoph_mobile (~yaaic@89.204.153.206) has joined the channel
+
[14:50:44] louis_to yes, to both!
[14:42:16] louis_to yes, I saw mh's mail
+
[14:50:49] louis_to and that was my next point
[14:42:24] louis_to so, does this mean that jsc is doing it?
+
[14:50:59] louis_to Welcome to Eike!
[14:42:30] louis_to will jsc then update the wiki?
+
[14:51:05] erAck thanks&nbsp;:)
[14:42:45] jsc no, Martin wanted to finish this work
+
[14:51:17] jsc i think we should inform Olivier about our frequent meetings ...
[14:43:03] jsc that is as least my understnding so far
+
[14:51:18] stx12 you'll have fun with us&nbsp;;-)
[14:43:05] louis_to then we let MH update the wiki with an "in progress" and date for termination, yes?
+
[14:51:21] louis_to I'd like to then issue a public welcome, as we did with the others
[14:43:23] louis_to then let's move on to #4
+
[14:51:27] christoph_n or make fun of us
[14:43:33] louis_to Work with Clayton on estimates for Developing developers documentation
+
[14:51:43] louis_to and only regret that we, or at least I, cannot be part of the anticipated beer party&nbsp;:-)
[14:43:33] louis_to Accepted
+
[14:53:59] jsc AI closed? Louis will send the official welcome mail
[14:43:33] louis_to Jürgen
+
[14:55:29] louis_to yes
[14:43:45] louis_to jsc: do you have update?
+
[14:55:36] louis_to today, in fact
[14:43:57] jsc i asked for feedback and that was limited ...
+
[14:55:51] stx12 plus the thanks to our former members; btw now i have the chance to introduce martin as my stand-in
[14:44:19] louis_to okay, please update with what you received the wiki
+
[14:56:20] louis_to yes.
[14:44:23] jsc so we are redy to start and we are in contact with the marketing to announce it
+
[14:56:22] louis_to&nbsp;:-)
[14:44:32] louis_to great!
+
[14:56:36] jsc yes, and please include a link on our meeting schedule in the welcome mail
[14:44:54] jsc i expect it next week
+
[14:56:41] louis_to the only item for elections reconsideration is the Produt Dev. Rep.
[14:44:54] louis_to btw, can this inter-relate with the Seneca College issue?
+
[14:56:48] louis_to thanks; good point
[14:45:16] louis_to I see these, along with the internship programme, as continuous
+
[14:57:01] louis_to I'll send it first to discuss@council
[14:45:33] louis_to but, we can discuss this offlist, but please update the wiki
+
[14:57:45] louis_to by the way, I think using "accepted/ non accepted" is not quite so felicitous in English, and I'd prefer a slightly different terminology, but it's not important, really
[14:45:47] jsc i am not sure, the bounties are documentation only. Or what do you mean?
+
[14:57:57] louis_to I refer to: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council/Elections/2010-03
[14:46:24] jsc the wiki is updated and we are working on the announcement
+
[14:57:58] christoph_n Proposals welcome...
[14:46:25] louis_to fardad's interest in getting to know how to proceed with Seneca college instructions for OOo would benefit from documentation
+
[14:58:22] christoph_n (I thought  about it, really.)
[14:46:39] louis_to and woiuld possibly be able to engage students, etc. in this, too
+
[14:58:25] louis_to stx12: have you added Olivier and Eike to the discuss@coiuncil list and Christoph, have you updated the relevant web page?
[14:46:47] * CorNouws S... again
+
[14:58:40] louis_to or jsc?
[14:46:59] louis_to yes; same old
+
[14:58:52] christoph_n I don't have write access (or, I never tried).
[14:47:15] jsc well we have to see how well the bounties get accepted or not ...
+
[14:58:54] louis_to in short, we need to update the relevant pages with the new members' information
[14:47:31] louis_to we paid 40K for classes to be given by Seneca and it's happening next year; Fardad S. of Seneca needs to coordinate with the developers so as to be able to be mroe effective
+
[14:59:01] jsc i have updated the council webpage
[14:47:35] louis_to not much from us is required
+
[14:59:08] louis_to really? I guess I failed to give you that; I shall do so now
[14:48:14] louis_to but this is distinct from bounties but not entirely opposed to it, as the issue is to create material that allows new developers to come up to speed on coding for OOo
+
[14:59:26] louis_to jsc, thanks
[14:48:17] jsc i do my best but i can not work as i do currently ;-)
+
[14:59:39] christoph_n Ah, forced reload makes it visible.
[14:48:32] jsc ... more as i do ...
+
[14:59:51] stx12 louis_to: no, i'll add them to the list...
[14:48:35] CorNouws Indeed, Seneca
+
[15:00:03] jsc well the new design is till missing
[14:48:41] CorNouws (wrong key)
+
[15:00:04] christoph_n @jsc: Could you please update the "five project leads" issue? This doesn't conform to the current CC structure.
[14:48:52] CorNouws INdeed, Senaca has nothing to do with current topic
+
[15:00:31] jsc ok, i will correct it
[14:48:58] louis_to of course; but this is more an effort along the lines of , "hi, I'm here to listen and provide some suggestions."
+
[15:00:42] christoph_n Sorry, of course ... don't update the issue. *g*
[14:49:15] louis_to CorNouws: As I stated, I thought it was continuous not identical
+
[15:01:13] louis_to christoph_n: off channle, can you send me your username for OOo?
[14:49:19] CorNouws http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council/Meeting_Guidelines
+
[15:01:19] louis_to likewise, eike, I forgot yours
[14:49:30] louis_to !
+
[15:01:27] louis_to thanks, stx12
[14:49:46] jsc let's move on to the next AI and let discuss this offline...
+
[15:01:34] christoph_n Yes, I can do that - anyway: christophnoack
[14:50:02] louis_to #5. Internship
+
[15:01:35] erAck louis_to: er
[14:50:27] louis_to it's been marked "finalized"
+
[15:01:57] louis_to okay, once these are doine, list esp., the key procedural issues for new members is tkane care of, lacking only the re-process of the dev. rep.
[14:50:40] louis_to does that mean that it can then be removed from the agenda?
+
[15:02:07] louis_to thanks, eike
[14:50:47] jsc a short update on the ongoing application process ...
+
[15:02:15] stx12 eike and olivier are subscribed
[14:50:48] louis_to I see no value keeping it there
+
[15:02:21] louis_to thanks
[14:50:54] louis_to okay.....
+
[15:04:08] christoph_n Next item?
[14:51:18] jsc we have more than 7 applications so far that we evaluate
+
[15:04:11] louis_to so, on to #2
[14:51:51] louis_to great; and many have sent me and florian applications we've then asked to route to Cor and others ....
+
[15:04:23] louis_to I have not sent what I meant to two weeks ago, the update to the language
[14:51:52] * mhu wonders what "more than 7" may mean, 8, 80, 800 :-)
+
[15:04:30] louis_to my only change that is substantial:
[14:52:08] jsc we select carefully and accept only the projects where we have mentors
+
[15:04:42] louis_to after 6 months, the project can be deemed to be effectively dead
[14:52:13] jsc > 75
+
[15:04:53] louis_to if there is no meaningful activity oin the lists
[14:52:19] louis_to ah
+
[15:05:04] louis_to this obtains for both NLC and Incubator projects
[14:52:24] louis_to that is indeed more than seven
+
[15:05:40] louis_to I'd also liek to add the clarification that merely by having an INcubator project--we want many---does not mean that it will necessarily go on to Accepted status
[14:52:56] louis_to shall we move on to #6 and no longer feature #5?
+
[15:05:41] jsc sounds reasonable for me
[14:53:08] jsc but of course the quality is very different
+
[15:05:56] louis_to it means nothing at all, in fact and to move on requires a specific request by the lead
[14:53:38] jsc ups, yes please next #6
+
[15:06:47] christoph_n Short question: Is there a complete text available? I didn't see anything on counci-discuss ... nor in my inbox (but maybe I have missed it).
[14:54:45] louis_to ;#6: Talk to Education Project Leads about structure and remit
+
[15:06:51] louis_to my addition of that latter comes from a discussion I had recently, where "incubator" was seen as inevitably leading to accepted
[14:54:59] louis_to Cor, has anything been done on this?
+
[15:07:10] louis_to christoph_n: no
[14:55:28] CorNouws No, not yet.
+
[15:07:15] louis_to but I will send it in
[14:55:29] CorNouws Als, I thought I had expressed my feeling (in a mail or a previous meeting) that ATM there are other items in the community that are more urgent, so to say ..
+
[15:07:28] christoph_n Okay.
[14:55:35] CorNouws als / also
+
[15:07:42] louis_to the language for both is fairly similar but the incubator has the divergences: does one want to make it an accepted or keep it as is?
[14:55:58] CorNouws however, afaiac, it will not be forgotten ..
+
[15:08:14] jsc i would like to talk more about specific tasks. And not about projects. Sometimes we need things to be done and they are finished the task is finished and that's it. No further activity necessary ...  
[14:56:22] CorNouws if someone has a reason for more urgency, pls let me know
+
[15:08:16] louis_to and if it is to be clsoed, is this then a fore-step in the process to accepted, in which case, "closure" is simply a renaming, oir is it really a sign of neglect
[14:56:30] CorNouws mail or irc or so
+
[15:08:29] louis_to jsc: context?
[14:56:41] * jsc is thinking if we need a status stalled
+
[15:08:42] jsc .. when they are finished ...
[14:57:32] louis_to perhaps but updating the wiki would be enough, I think
+
[15:08:49] louis_to an incubator / project can be of that sort
[14:57:45] louis_to with what was just related---that's adequate to give insight
+
[15:09:00] louis_to stx12 and I had this dicussion about 7, 8 years ago
[14:58:04] CorNouws ok for me - I ?l do that
+
[15:09:14] jsc i think it's wrong to create new projects for everything ...
[14:58:07] louis_to let's move on to #7: NLC of the month
+
[15:09:16] louis_to and the issue then is the issue now: to devise, using CollabNet's tools, ad hoc projects
[14:58:08] louis_to thanks, Cor
+
[15:09:37] louis_to and that was the issue that he raised, as a project is a memory that will linger, no matter how we expunge it
[14:58:13] louis_to Charles?
+
[15:09:50] louis_to the solution as such is to use the wiki and subproject
[14:58:21] louis_to aka southerncross
+
[15:09:59] louis_to but then that has NOTHING to do with an incubator project as such
[14:58:31] southerncross yes
+
[15:10:27] louis_to but need only be mentioned in the guidelines, and the logistics there woiuld be to work with the iteam that comes into being for this purpose
[14:58:40] louis_to would you have an update?
+
[15:10:33] louis_to so that one can find it
[14:58:42] southerncross so I had several issues
+
[15:10:41] louis_to I can put some language to that point, thanks
[14:58:43] southerncross to be frank
+
[15:10:53] louis_to eg, if oine wants an ad hoc project, then doi X, Y, Z.
[14:58:50] southerncross I am sad to report
+
[15:11:10] louis_to or to resolve a specific problem or task
[14:58:58] southerncross that not only do I not have any update
+
[15:11:30] louis_to but we also resolved this long ago by focusing more on IssueZilla, as we had it then
[14:59:14] southerncross but that each of the project I personally contacted
+
[15:11:37] jsc the term project as we use it tody raise too much expectations from my point of view
[14:59:21] southerncross never even replied to me :-(
+
[15:11:47] jsc but hey it's  my personal opinion
[14:59:27] southerncross or claimed they didn't have time
+
[15:11:49] louis_to yes, we agree, jsc, and we are way ahead of you
[14:59:39] southerncross I will continue to look for a project though.
+
[15:12:07] louis_to and I simply a) agreed, and b) laid out solution, and c) provided historical context
[14:59:40] louis_to southerncross: can you work with me on this, pelase?
+
[15:12:54] jsc ok, go ahead ...
[14:59:45] southerncross sure
+
[15:13:01] louis_to right, so #3
[15:00:10] louis_to thanks. let's reconnnoitre tomorrow or later on tonight and get some articlles going
+
[15:13:17] louis_to Martin's AI....
[15:00:16] olivierhallot well... if you need food for the newsletter I can provide tons from Brazil... We have our own NL...
+
[15:13:48] louis_to given the absence of MH, I'd suggest to just send in a proposal to the list along the lines of,
[15:00:17] * louis_to apologies for bad typing.
+
[15:14:23] jsc i will talk to Martin and if necessary will take over this AI
[15:00:25] louis_to olivierhallot: thanks!!
+
[15:14:31] louis_to thanks
[15:00:39] louis_to and we can surely engage the Gallegos in Spain, and more
+
[15:14:39] mhu maybe, we could ask Martin to send his proposal&nbsp;?
[15:00:56] louis_to but let's drive this, with some standard questions, etc. and we can discuss this offlist
+
[15:14:56] mhu okay, thanks jsc
[15:01:11] * louis_to is acutely conscious of time pressure
+
[15:14:58] louis_to it's not so hard.... just to focus on getting qs. from the peopel and also setting up a time period
[15:01:11] southerncross olivierhallot: yes
+
[15:15:08] louis_to kidn of like what we do during OOoCon
[15:01:32] southerncross I am confident of this since we have over 100 projects
+
[15:15:33] mhu right
[15:01:39] louis_to uhm.  
+
[15:18:48] christoph_n (tick tack tick ta...)
[15:01:45] southerncross so there's room for improvement and choice
+
[15:19:01] louis_to move on to #4
[15:01:46] louis_to let's move on to the next item?
+
[15:19:10] jsc see the update in the agenda
[15:02:03] louis_to 2010-04-01#1
+
[15:19:12] jsc no real update because the lack of time.  But we are working on it and i hope to publish a first draft soon (probably next week)
[15:02:03] louis_to Community situation
+
[15:19:13] jsc I am looking forward how this concept will be accepted and how it will work ...
[15:02:36] louis_to does any one of us have an update?
+
[15:19:58] louis_to thanks. can you suggest when there might be an update?
[15:02:46] louis_to "What do we see, where are we, what are we going to do about it."
+
[15:20:06] louis_to my interest relates to:
[15:02:49] CorNouws :-)
+
[15:20:11] jsc sorry that i can't give more new info but i had an unplanned stop for 5 days in Brazil
[15:03:03] CorNouws ai for all, so no one has an update, obvious
+
[15:20:16] louis_to a) it's nearly summer for many students in the North Hemisphere
[15:03:07] louis_to * no update*
+
[15:20:20] louis_to ah
[15:03:25] louis_to let's move on to #2
+
[15:20:28] louis_to yes, am familiar with that problem....
[15:03:41] louis_to Missing OOo desktop presence
+
[15:20:35] louis_to and with ashy forecsats.
[15:03:57] louis_to Assigned and accepted by Stx and Christoph
+
[15:21:15] louis_to b) I'd like to see if we can aim this for the coming school year, as the summer  period may be over by now for new issues like this
[15:04:06] louis_to stx12, would you have an update?
+
[15:21:30] jsc well the bounties are open for all not only students and if they get well accepted it can be an ongoing effort as long as we have money for new  ...
[15:04:07] *** christoph_mobile has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
+
[15:22:06] louis_to right; but it's the marketing that will attract new (students or not) that needs to be pitched....
[15:04:38] stx12 louis_to: christoph moved forward with that.  
+
[15:22:08] louis_to that's all
[15:04:59] CorNouws may I give a little update?
+
[15:22:35] louis_to for instance, it'd be very cool to announce something like this at OOoCon or even at Oracle Open World
[15:05:05] louis_to please
+
[15:23:12] jsc sure, i will do my best and i am sure that we will have something to announce soon
[15:05:56] CorNouws Christoph had contact with Olivier and me about joining the i-team, and since Olivier and I neither are experts, we think we can help by joining both
+
[15:23:13] louis_to oir at Oscon (July) or even at something similar elsewhere in the world... too late for LinuxTag, alas
[15:06:09] *** christoph_mobile (~yaaic@89.204.153.206) has joined the channel
+
[15:23:19] louis_to thanks!!
[15:06:24] CorNouws so that means that basically the work can start, if I am right
+
[15:23:32] louis_to #5....
[15:07:02] louis_to great!
+
[15:23:46] louis_to no update....
[15:07:06] louis_to what will you be doing, then?
+
[15:23:51] louis_to #6...
[15:07:24] CorNouws Christoph will draft a plan for that
+
[15:23:54] * mhu thinks, louis_to is talking about internship, not docu bounties&nbsp;?
[15:07:41] CorNouws has to do with icons, feed back and colors
+
[15:24:04] stx12 actually there is... for #5
[15:07:54] southerncross sounds good indeed
+
[15:24:10] louis_to go ahead.....
[15:08:02] CorNouws (probably Orange, Dutch soccer WC you know ;-) )
+
[15:24:46] stx12 we stumbled over the budget and cor asked us (mhu, mh and me) to think about a resolution.
[15:08:06] louis_to :-)
+
[15:25:18] stx12 it was proposed to use some of the money left from last year for the internship.
[15:08:11] louis_to uhm. when's the first game?  
+
[15:26:02] stx12 we think there is a one time opportunity to do that and raise the development budget.
[15:08:25] CorNouws may children say tomorrow
+
[15:26:46] stx12 we should avoid the impression that we can do that on a regular basis. but we would like to run the internship every year.
[15:08:26] louis_to or will you remind me of meeting protocols, too? :-)
+
[15:27:04] louis_to thanks.
[15:08:31] CorNouws may = my
+
[15:27:18] louis_to I'd be hopeful we can obtain a regular source from a corporate angel
[15:08:35] louis_to :-)
+
[15:27:19] stx12 second there was an amount of 8 slots x 4000 EUR proposed.
[15:08:40] stx12 CorNouws: I~m afraid we have to agree on no colors then..
+
[15:27:42] stx12 at least i understood that we talked about EUR.
[15:08:53] * louis_to has been rather glued to his iphone app for this........
+
[15:27:59] mhu ...increase the budget, so that docu bounties and internship can be covered this year. ... stx12 is explaining it all ... so I stay silent ...
[15:09:10] louis_to ... and Toronto is going crazy
+
[15:28:12] stx12 lokking at similar programs this amount seems to high.  
[15:09:29] olivierhallot no... but South Affrica flag has enough colors to pick many...  
+
[15:28:17] stx12 too high.
[15:09:31] louis_to okay, we look forward to substantial updates to the wiki and to the emails, and I thank you and Christoph
+
[15:28:32] louis_to stx12: that was my impression, too, but Cor pointed out the math....
[15:09:36] louis_to :-)
+
[15:28:41] louis_to ie, 8 X 4K
[15:09:46] * louis_to roots for Mexico, of course :-)
+
[15:29:11] stx12 i'm fine with 4k USD or 3.5K EUR (which is even more)  
[15:10:45] * southerncross feels he has no comments to make the about the French team :-/
+
[15:29:23] jsc me too
[15:11:00] louis_to thsi one item, next, has been rejected. It ought to be removed from the agenda, I think: Do not promote proprietary software through the OpenOffice.org extensions library
+
[15:29:58] mhu finally, we have not (yet) so much money as Google
[15:11:16] CorNouws yep
+
[15:30:08] stx12 so we will clarify the budget with martin (who is the owner) so that we can run the internship and the bounties and have a bit air to breath
[15:11:17] louis_to it's 2010-05-07#1
+
[15:30:31] jsc sounds like a plan
[15:11:20] olivierhallot agree
+
[15:30:44] stx12 an dmartin just send a message that other expenses shouldn't be a blocker.
[15:11:23] louis_to please let's delete it then
+
[15:31:14] stx12 to me this sounds like we are ready to continue with the internship as planned by cor and friends...
[15:11:38] * mhu thinks, that's the nice thing with international communities: some OOo country will surely win :-)
+
[15:31:48] louis_to yes.
[15:11:43] louis_to and move on to 05-20#1, next council coordinator
+
[15:32:19] mhu yes
[15:11:56] louis_to mhu: :-)
+
[15:32:28] jsc yes, should inform Cor about the update ...
[15:12:17] louis_to whoever wins can host the next OOoCon :-)
+
[15:32:44] jsc .. i inform ...
[15:12:17] * southerncross nods
+
[15:32:49] louis_to shall we then update the item&nbsp;? It seems quite solid and also allows us then to move publicly with this, once we have the other elements
[15:12:24] mhu :-)
+
[15:33:25] louis_to that is to say, "What remains for the internship to move forward?"
[15:12:27] * louis_to is joking
+
[15:34:00] jsc update of the related wiki page, i can at least update the money related items
[15:12:32] * CorNouws we let Germany winn the Euro Song Festival, so now it's our turn :-)
+
[15:34:08] louis_to thanks
[15:12:33] southerncross heh...
+
[15:34:20] louis_to and then? I mean, when can we start soliciting for interns, etc.?
[15:12:42] louis_to but the item on council coordinator is no joke...
+
[15:34:26] louis_to there are many who could be interested
[15:12:59] stx12 but you are better singers than football players...
+
[15:34:36] stx12 initiate the budget request with martin...
[15:13:08] CorNouws do all have a good idea of the task?
+
[15:34:48] louis_to and I' dlike to ensure that we work with marketing on this  
[15:13:17] louis_to yes, I think so
+
[15:35:02] louis_to which i can do, but ....  
[15:13:21] CorNouws how heavy load it is and such
+
[15:35:45] stx12 cor, jsc and mathias b. will takes this i guess.
[15:13:31] CorNouws Christoph and Stefan can tell
+
[15:36:21] louis_to then let's ask them to work with Marketing...
[15:14:09] louis_to shall we set a deadline for this selection?
+
[15:36:25] jsc i have already promoted it or at least the plans in Brazil&nbsp;;-)
[15:14:27] louis_to http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council#Council_coordinator
+
[15:36:35] jsc i will take care of it
[15:14:28] CorNouws possibly it is more frustrating than time consuming - depends on how you experience it..
+
[15:37:33] erAck before we market internships, wouldn't we need tasks from the projects first that could be worked on in an internship?
[15:14:33] jsc come on to shorten this, i volunteer
+
[15:38:17] louis_to yes.
[15:14:40] stx12 it depends how much you invest; and we were not able to come close to cor's investment... nevertheless it's worth the effort.
+
[15:38:37] jsc well, we have the to-do lists and of course people can suggest their own project.
[15:14:51] stx12 thanks jsc
+
[15:38:43] stx12 that's what i raised last time. the approach was planned a bit different to avoid the blocker. but yes, that helps.
[15:14:56] louis_to yes, thanks.
+
[15:38:45] louis_to much needs to be refined, first, but we can still Market the idea in general and start engaging the MKT group to expand its boundaries
[15:14:57] CorNouws jsc: great !
+
[15:38:58] erAck ok
[15:15:05] olivierhallot jsc, thanks indeed.
+
[15:39:12] christoph_n The "project proposals" aren't up to date, I think. The wiki page by Cor lists some suggestions how to continue.
[15:15:05] louis_to jsc: would you update the wiki entry, then, please?
+
[15:39:44] stx12 i think i will call for "task proposals" anyway - if noone objects...
[15:15:06] mhu yes, +1 to jsc
+
[15:39:58] christoph_n stx12: Very good!
[15:15:07] louis_to thanks!
+
[15:40:10] jsc up to date is relative. Ideas that ae not yet implemented are still open...
[15:15:34] louis_to do we have new items for discussion today?
+
[15:40:54] stx12 yes, but not every idea / effort / task / project is in scope for the internship...
[15:15:47] jsc the wiki entry for the coordinator? Yes
+
[15:41:12] stx12 let's put out a list in parallel to all the todos.
[15:15:59] jsc i will start with the next meeting
+
[15:41:18] louis_to I think any new proposal must be negotiated
[15:16:40] * mhu still thinks about 75 applications for 7 internships; we are then rejecting 90% of applicants; will they come back, sometime ?
+
[15:41:55] louis_to shall we move on to #6?
[15:17:22] stx12 we are not rejecting but inviting to spend some of their freetime...
+
[15:42:10] stx12 yes
[15:17:39] stx12 on a voluntary basis...  
+
[15:42:25] mhu yes
[15:17:50] mhu yeah, that's the fine print :-) I was more general ...
+
[15:42:52] jsc yes
[15:18:10] jsc mhu: that's life. We have only limited budget and a limited number of qualified mentors
+
[15:43:02] louis_to nothing substantial I can add to agenda items; it has to do with the actual remit of Education project. This will be more feasibly addressed now that the internship program is moving forward, I believe
[15:18:35] jsc ... mentors with time
+
[15:43:48] louis_to shall we move on to #7?
[15:18:50] mhu yes, I guess I have an idea about the budget; any ideas what to do with all hose willing people ?
+
[15:44:09] christoph_n Mmh, should we then close it? Or just wait...
[15:19:01] mhu s/hose/those/
+
[15:44:14] stx12 yes, where is sotherncross btw...
[15:19:05] CorNouws and for each serious applicant it can be disappointing, but it does not become worse fot he indiviual if there are more that cannot join
+
[15:44:17] louis_to afaik, no updates, but I do have a really long and interesting email from Sinhala
[15:19:27] louis_to I would love to see if they would want to join in the Seneca effort as "distance" learners, if possible
+
[15:44:34] christoph_n (Sorry, I meant #6)
[15:19:50] * mhu finds it astonishing to see so much interest
+
[15:44:49] louis_to project lead, and I'll see if I can put that into the newsletter. it pertains to questions related to OOo in Sinhala and other issues
[15:20:29] mhu ...I am not saying we're doing anything wrong; just whether we could make something from it
+
[15:45:17] louis_to but let's move onto post-#7
[15:20:31] CorNouws I am not sure if all made a seriuos study of their changes to be choosen ..
+
[15:46:14] louis_to and I confess I doin't see how we can discuss these items here as proposals requriing yes/no votes
[15:20:32] * stx12 is not too surprised about the number - it's similar to the earlier efforts of similar campaigns
+
[15:46:24] louis_to if anyone wants to add insight here....
[15:20:36] jsc leading country is India ;-)
+
[15:46:51] christoph_n Sorry, do we really talk about 2010-04-01#7?
[15:20:42] mhu sure
+
[15:47:32] louis_to my point is&nbsp;: no
[15:21:13] stx12 ok, guys; i have ot leave; have fun...  
+
[15:47:41] louis_to until they are framed in a way that allows for talk
[15:21:22] mhu bye, stx12
+
[15:47:49] louis_to so, I'd like to call to adjourn today's meeting
[15:21:40] CorNouws yes, maybe an easy, lighther programm that gives some credit / referrence for the student and little revenue too??
+
[15:48:06] louis_to IRC log will be posted shortly; AIs: I ask someone else to update the page?
[15:21:52] CorNouws I have one more point, just a not, from Sophie
+
[15:48:20] christoph_n Sorry, there are some items that are important.
[15:21:58] CorNouws not = note
+
[15:48:25] louis_to and before ending today's, I'd like to ask Eike if he has anytinmng he wants to add...
[15:22:00] louis_to thanks
+
[15:48:29] mhu can we at least quickly talk about next meetings schedule (last item)
[15:22:10] mhu CorNouws: get them accept documentation bounties, instead ?
+
[15:48:31] louis_to oh, okay, go ahead
[15:22:20] CorNouws one especially for mhu: Sophie pointed me to the fact that there is some mony at SPI  allocated for the OOo project!
+
[15:48:45] louis_to agreed: christoph_n: go ahead
[15:22:21] CorNouws can be a good start for internship 2011, probably
+
[15:48:58] christoph_n Okay.
[15:22:58] louis_to okay, thanks
+
[15:49:04] erAck louis_to: I've nothing to add today.
[15:23:00] CorNouws mhu: maybe, lets discuss this in the mail contests@ for example
+
[15:49:11] christoph_n Jumping to 2010-04-29#1: CC Election
[15:23:13] louis_to do we use contests@
+
[15:49:26] christoph_n Everybody knows the current situation - the proposal is to re-do the election cycle.
[15:23:14] louis_to ?
+
[15:49:38] christoph_n First question: Do we agree here?
[15:23:14] mhu well, yes; that's a couple thousand (few) dollars; and yes, we should somehow claim (and spend) that money
+
[15:49:53] christoph_n (for the Product Dev Representative)
[15:23:29] louis_to I thought I was subscribed to it but have not received posts from that list
+
[15:50:02] stx12 yes
[15:23:31] southerncross contests@?
+
[15:50:03] erAck yes
[15:23:33] mhu well, I donT see much on contests@
+
[15:50:06] louis_to +1
[15:23:52] CorNouws contests@marketing.openoffice.org
+
[15:50:27] mhu +1
[15:23:56] mhu yes, I am subscribed also
+
[15:50:30] jsc +1
[15:24:11] southerncross thanks CorNouws
+
[15:50:32] christoph_n +1
[15:24:16] CorNouws we did quite some preparations there. Unnoticed?
+
[15:50:40] christoph_n Okay, are there any other seats to be elected (soon)? Can we combine an election?
[15:24:21] mhu and, no, most of the discussion obviously happens elsewhere
+
[15:51:19] louis_to christoph_n: that would be for me, new product dev, and who else? mhu, I believe
[15:24:41] jsc not much traffic even not on the new internship list
+
[15:51:29] mhu probably
[15:24:42] mhu yes, the preparations
+
[15:51:44] christoph_n probably ... with a tendency towards ...&nbsp;:-)
[15:24:50] CorNouws on list as much as possible, I would say
+
[15:52:00] mhu ...1
[15:25:02] mhu okay, then we didnt miss much
+
[15:52:28] christoph_n Okay, are there any reasons to wait a few days/weeks, or should we start as soon as possible?
[15:25:06] jsc yes, until now most often private emails
+
[15:52:41] christoph_n (I think we can start in a few days.)
[15:25:31] mhu CorNouws: yes, lets discuss at contests@
+
[15:52:46] stx12 please remeeber that we can only run 1 election for a constituency at a time.  
[15:26:18] louis_to okahy, are we all subscribed, that want to?K
+
[15:52:56] stx12 i don't see a need to wait.
[15:26:49] *** christoph_mobile has quit IRC (Quit: Yaaic - Yet another Android IRC client - http://www.yaaic.org)
+
[15:53:04] mhu we used to have some overlap between old and new members terms ...
[15:26:55] *** stx12 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
+
[15:53:20] louis_to i would wait until June, so as the new members can learn what is what
[15:27:05] southerncross I'll subscribe
+
[15:53:30] louis_to and this is echoing mhu
[15:29:22] jsc do we have finished for today?
+
[15:53:31] stx12 a few days is ok; but then let's restart the election for the product dev seat.  
[15:29:25] louis_to yes.
+
[15:53:37] mhu thats what i wanted to say
[15:29:44] jsc ok, i have to leave now, bye
+
[15:53:40] christoph_n Ah, so the "5 project leads representatives" are like "product dev seats".
[15:29:54] olivierhallot bye folks
+
[15:54:15] stx12 no, they are a mixture of prod dev and code contribs
[15:30:00] mhu bye all, have a nice evening / afternoon
+
[15:54:45] christoph_n Okay, to be clear: We start the election cycle as soon as possible to find a representative for the product dev.
[15:30:00] *** jsc is now known as jsc_away
+
[15:54:58] christoph_n mhu and louis_to have to wait&nbsp;;-)
[15:30:03] CorNouws bye bye & thanks
+
[15:54:58] stx12 christoph_n: yes
[15:30:09] louis_to meeting ajdourned; thanks all
+
[15:55:06] mhu yes
 +
[15:55:08] louis_to yes, that is desired
 +
[15:55:23] christoph_n Good, then I'll prepare the wiki page to election 2010-05.
 +
[15:55:35] christoph_n Upcoming ...
 +
[15:55:48] stx12 thanks
 +
[15:55:49] christoph_n 2010-04-29#2: Missing OOo desktop presence
 +
[15:56:11] christoph_n I know that it is late, but we already missed the request for the last meeting. Let's - at least - see how to deal with it.
 +
[15:56:32] louis_to christoph_n: my point was and is that it needs to be framed in a way that is actionable
 +
[15:56:34] louis_to it is not now
 +
[15:56:46] louis_to if you wish to frame it that way, go ahead
 +
[15:57:37] christoph_n My question was about how to continue. Is a discussion (soon) on the list appropriate for all?
 +
[15:57:53] mhu yes
 +
[15:58:12] christoph_n At least, we accept this AI since it is a community member request - yes?
 +
[15:58:20] louis_to not necessarily
 +
[15:58:30] louis_to why don't you send it to the list and let us deal with it there?
 +
[15:58:44] louis_to a proper question and proposal must be actionable and must be within our remit
 +
[15:58:46] christoph_n Cor already asked us and nobody (really) replied.
 +
[15:58:55] louis_to we cannot accept those things that are out of our buonds
 +
[15:59:06] stx12 we hear the request and will propose a follow-up activity.
 +
[15:59:09] louis_to and Cor's acceptance is not the same as our being able to actualluy act on it
 +
[15:59:48] christoph_n stx12: Hear means, to forward it to council-discuss?
 +
[16:00:05] louis_to christoph_n: yes, please
 +
[16:00:27] christoph_n Louis, what would make this item "more actionable"?
 +
[16:00:41] louis_to can we vote&nbsp;? is it within our remit?
 +
[16:00:46] stx12 no, it means, we heard / read it. i was going to say that i'm not sure that we will decide / discuss the question, but propose how to proceed.
 +
[16:00:46] louis_to let's see it on the list, please
 +
[16:01:11] louis_to I disagree with stx12 then, as I believe this should be framed in a way that can worked with if at all on the list
 +
[16:01:56] stx12 fine with me; i didn't think of raising proposals now.
 +
[16:02:30] jsc fine for me as well, let's move on the list
 +
[16:02:33] christoph_n I'm lost a bit&nbsp;:-) Louis, then please answer on the (upcoming) request on council-discuss how it can be made "more actionable" and "better framed".
 +
[16:02:45] christoph_n Good. Last item...
 +
[16:02:52] louis_to sure
 +
[16:02:53] christoph_n 2010-04-29#3: CC meetings calendar
 +
[16:03:38] christoph_n I'm more or less fine with the two weeks schedule, but the last 3 times either IRC Log or Meeting Minutes were missing. So if we need more time (or pressure) we should go back to the old schedule.
 +
[16:03:48] christoph_n (last time: both missing)
 +
[16:04:17] stx12 christoph_n: the last log was not linked but at the usual location
 +
[16:04:22] * mhu is fine with the dates as proposed in the calendar (i.e. 3 weeks schedule)
 +
[16:04:35] louis_to me too
 +
[16:04:42] christoph_n (Then I'll link it.)
 +
[16:04:56] stx12 done already
 +
[16:05:03] christoph_n stx12 -- cool!
 +
[16:05:15] christoph_n Eike, Jürgen, Stefan?
 +
[16:05:35] jsc i am not available in 2 weeks -&gt; vacation. And i will check the other dates ... most of them looks fine
 +
[16:05:42] stx12 fine with me; now that i have a stand-in&nbsp;;-)
 +
[16:05:46] christoph_n&nbsp;;-)
 +
[16:05:57] christoph_n (So Martin is with us all the time...)
 +
[16:06:21] erAck every 3 weeks is fine, I think.
 +
[16:06:24] christoph_n Eike, you may not agree to each of the items - just state if you are generally fine.
 +
[16:06:26] christoph_n (Oh, thanks)
 +
[16:06:27] stx12 he is on irc but to shy to join&nbsp;;-)
 +
[16:07:00] christoph_n Okay, anything else?
 +
[16:07:05] * erAck is switching back and forth between browser and irc ...
 +
[16:07:19] jsc i saw, the next meeting is in 3 weeks. It's fine for&nbsp;;-)
 +
[16:07:41] christoph_n Good. One last question: How to deal with the minutes?
 +
[16:07:55] louis_to by minutes youi mean AIs
 +
[16:07:56] louis_to yes?
 +
[16:07:57] christoph_n I can incorporate the changes for the last items I "moderated"
 +
[16:07:59] louis_to I can do the IRC
 +
[16:08:14] louis_to and I ahd asked for updates to the webpage continaing the agneda with AIs
 +
[16:08:21] louis_to there was no response; you are asking that again
 +
[16:09:00] christoph_n Since we agreed to manage both agenda and work status in one table ...
 +
[16:09:05] louis_to my impression was that we were all responsible for updating our own AIs
 +
[16:09:28] louis_to thereore, it is the responsibiliy of the AI assignee to update the webpage, yes?
 +
[16:09:31] christoph_n Will we do that? The last times it didn't work (well).
 +
[16:09:43] louis_to let's try it again.k
 +
[16:09:52] louis_to rahter than waste time here&nbsp;:-)
 +
[16:09:54] christoph_n We agreed on one person to "finalize" (minor touches) the agenda and copy it to the meeting minutes page.
 +
[16:11:06] christoph_n Waste = neither having a clear agenda nor minutes for the community
 +
[16:11:42] louis_to then I'll finalize it but requre that all with AIs update their relevant sections
 +
[16:11:54] christoph_n Will do that today, I think.
 +
[16:11:54] louis_to and I'll post this IRC to the usual location after meeting ends
 +
[16:13:04] christoph_n If this is okay for everyone, we may close this meeting. Louis, okay?
 +
[16:13:17] louis_to yes, and only indicate if it is NOT okay
 +
[16:13:20] louis_to&nbsp;:-)
 +
[16:13:26] louis_to so all in favour of adjourning the meeting?
 
</pre>  
 
</pre>  
 
[[Category:Community_Council]]
 
[[Category:Community_Council]]

Latest revision as of 21:41, 10 June 2010

IRC Log 2010-04-29

  • Supposed start time: 18:30 UTC
  • Time offset −0400 UTC
  • Location: IRC

Attendees

  • Christoph Noack (christoph_n)
  • Eike Rathke (erAck)
  • Matthias Huetsch (mhu)
  • Louis Suárez-Potts (louis_to)
  • Stefan Taxhet (stx12)

Absent

  • Cor Nouws (holiday)
  • Charles-H. Schulz
  • Olivier Hallot
  • mystery candidate

Log

[14:47:00] * mhu thinks we should start
[14:47:12] louis_to we did 
[14:47:27] louis_to all in favour of prior minutes?
[14:47:48] louis_to oh---procedureal point: who is driving today's meeting? I can do it but is christoph_n wanting to?
[14:48:09] christoph_n Louis, go on :-) I just updated the agenda page.
[14:48:26] christoph_n Although I have to admit that there is no real agenda of the last meeting ...
[14:48:36] louis_to okay, thanks
[14:48:47] louis_to so we approve; any objections, please indicate now or in the list
[14:49:06] louis_to 1. : elections have taken place and results posted.k
[14:49:17] louis_to thanks to Stefan and the oithers for doing the work! 
[14:49:33] louis_to especial thanks to Stefan, in fact, who served as commisaire
[14:50:00] stx12 no, that was christoph_n
[14:50:07] louis_to ah :-)
[14:50:12] louis_to then my hat is off to you, tooi
[14:50:16] christoph_n ;-)
[14:50:28] christoph_n However, can we "close" this AI? There is a follow-up...
[14:50:33] * mhu thinks, speaking of election results, we should welcome Eike, no ?
[14:50:44] louis_to yes, to both!
[14:50:49] louis_to and that was my next point
[14:50:59] louis_to Welcome to Eike!
[14:51:05] erAck thanks :)
[14:51:17] jsc i think we should inform Olivier about our frequent meetings ...
[14:51:18] stx12 you'll have fun with us ;-)
[14:51:21] louis_to I'd like to then issue a public welcome, as we did with the others
[14:51:27] christoph_n or make fun of us
[14:51:43] louis_to and only regret that we, or at least I, cannot be part of the anticipated beer party :-)
[14:53:59] jsc AI closed? Louis will send the official welcome mail
[14:55:29] louis_to yes
[14:55:36] louis_to today, in fact
[14:55:51] stx12 plus the thanks to our former members; btw now i have the chance to introduce martin as my stand-in
[14:56:20] louis_to yes.
[14:56:22] louis_to :-)
[14:56:36] jsc yes, and please include a link on our meeting schedule in the welcome mail 
[14:56:41] louis_to the only item for elections reconsideration is the Produt Dev. Rep.
[14:56:48] louis_to thanks; good point
[14:57:01] louis_to I'll send it first to discuss@council
[14:57:45] louis_to by the way, I think using "accepted/ non accepted" is not quite so felicitous in English, and I'd prefer a slightly different terminology, but it's not important, really
[14:57:57] louis_to I refer to: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Community_Council/Elections/2010-03
[14:57:58] christoph_n Proposals welcome...
[14:58:22] christoph_n (I thought  about it, really.)
[14:58:25] louis_to stx12: have you added Olivier and Eike to the discuss@coiuncil list and Christoph, have you updated the relevant web page? 
[14:58:40] louis_to or jsc?
[14:58:52] christoph_n I don't have write access (or, I never tried).
[14:58:54] louis_to in short, we need to update the relevant pages with the new members' information
[14:59:01] jsc i have updated the council webpage
[14:59:08] louis_to really? I guess I failed to give you that; I shall do so now
[14:59:26] louis_to jsc, thanks
[14:59:39] christoph_n Ah, forced reload makes it visible.
[14:59:51] stx12 louis_to: no, i'll add them to the list...
[15:00:03] jsc well the new design is till missing
[15:00:04] christoph_n @jsc: Could you please update the "five project leads" issue? This doesn't conform to the current CC structure.
[15:00:31] jsc ok, i will correct it
[15:00:42] christoph_n Sorry, of course ... don't update the issue. *g*
[15:01:13] louis_to christoph_n: off channle, can you send me your username for OOo?
[15:01:19] louis_to likewise, eike, I forgot yours
[15:01:27] louis_to thanks, stx12
[15:01:34] christoph_n Yes, I can do that - anyway: christophnoack
[15:01:35] erAck louis_to: er
[15:01:57] louis_to okay, once these are doine, list esp., the key procedural issues for new members is tkane care of, lacking only the re-process of the dev. rep.
[15:02:07] louis_to thanks, eike
[15:02:15] stx12 eike and olivier are subscribed
[15:02:21] louis_to thanks
[15:04:08] christoph_n Next item?
[15:04:11] louis_to so, on to #2
[15:04:23] louis_to I have not sent what I meant to two weeks ago, the update to the language
[15:04:30] louis_to my only change that is substantial:
[15:04:42] louis_to after 6 months, the project can be deemed to be effectively dead
[15:04:53] louis_to if there is no meaningful activity oin the lists
[15:05:04] louis_to this obtains for both NLC and Incubator projects
[15:05:40] louis_to I'd also liek to add the clarification that merely by having an INcubator project--we want many---does not mean that it will necessarily go on to Accepted status
[15:05:41] jsc sounds reasonable for me
[15:05:56] louis_to it means nothing at all, in fact and to move on requires a specific request by the lead
[15:06:47] christoph_n Short question: Is there a complete text available? I didn't see anything on counci-discuss ... nor in my inbox (but maybe I have missed it).
[15:06:51] louis_to my addition of that latter comes from a discussion I had recently, where "incubator" was seen as inevitably leading to accepted
[15:07:10] louis_to christoph_n: no
[15:07:15] louis_to but I will send it in
[15:07:28] christoph_n Okay.
[15:07:42] louis_to the language for both is fairly similar but the incubator has the divergences: does one want to make it an accepted or keep it as is?
[15:08:14] jsc i would like to talk more about specific tasks. And not about projects. Sometimes we need things to be done and they are finished the task is finished and that's it. No further activity necessary ... 
[15:08:16] louis_to and if it is to be clsoed, is this then a fore-step in the process to accepted, in which case, "closure" is simply a renaming, oir is it really a sign of neglect
[15:08:29] louis_to jsc: context?
[15:08:42] jsc .. when they are finished ...
[15:08:49] louis_to an incubator / project can be of that sort
[15:09:00] louis_to stx12 and I had this dicussion about 7, 8 years ago
[15:09:14] jsc i think it's wrong to create new projects for everything ...
[15:09:16] louis_to and the issue then is the issue now: to devise, using CollabNet's tools, ad hoc projects
[15:09:37] louis_to and that was the issue that he raised, as a project is a memory that will linger, no matter how we expunge it
[15:09:50] louis_to the solution as such is to use the wiki and subproject
[15:09:59] louis_to but then that has NOTHING to do with an incubator project as such
[15:10:27] louis_to but need only be mentioned in the guidelines, and the logistics there woiuld be to work with the iteam that comes into being for this purpose
[15:10:33] louis_to so that one can find it
[15:10:41] louis_to I can put some language to that point, thanks
[15:10:53] louis_to eg, if oine wants an ad hoc project, then doi X, Y, Z.
[15:11:10] louis_to or to resolve a specific problem or task
[15:11:30] louis_to but we also resolved this long ago by focusing more on IssueZilla, as we had it then
[15:11:37] jsc the term project as we use it tody raise too much expectations from my point of view
[15:11:47] jsc but hey it's  my personal opinion
[15:11:49] louis_to yes, we agree, jsc, and we are way ahead of you
[15:12:07] louis_to and I simply a) agreed, and b) laid out solution, and c) provided historical context
[15:12:54] jsc ok, go ahead ...
[15:13:01] louis_to right, so #3
[15:13:17] louis_to Martin's AI....
[15:13:48] louis_to given the absence of MH, I'd suggest to just send in a proposal to the list along the lines of,
[15:14:23] jsc i will talk to Martin and if necessary will take over this AI
[15:14:31] louis_to thanks
[15:14:39] mhu maybe, we could ask Martin to send his proposal ?
[15:14:56] mhu okay, thanks jsc
[15:14:58] louis_to it's not so hard.... just to focus on getting qs. from the peopel and also setting up a time period
[15:15:08] louis_to kidn of like what we do during OOoCon
[15:15:33] mhu right
[15:18:48] christoph_n (tick tack tick ta...)
[15:19:01] louis_to move on to #4
[15:19:10] jsc see the update in the agenda
[15:19:12] jsc no real update because the lack of time.  But we are working on it and i hope to publish a first draft soon (probably next week)
[15:19:13] jsc I am looking forward how this concept will be accepted and how it will work ...
[15:19:58] louis_to thanks. can you suggest when there might be an update?
[15:20:06] louis_to my interest relates to:
[15:20:11] jsc sorry that i can't give more new info but i had an unplanned stop for 5 days in Brazil 
[15:20:16] louis_to a) it's nearly summer for many students in the North Hemisphere
[15:20:20] louis_to ah
[15:20:28] louis_to yes, am familiar with that problem....
[15:20:35] louis_to and with ashy forecsats.
[15:21:15] louis_to b) I'd like to see if we can aim this for the coming school year, as the summer  period may be over by now for new issues like this
[15:21:30] jsc well the bounties are open for all not only students and if they get well accepted it can be an ongoing effort as long as we have money for new  ... 
[15:22:06] louis_to right; but it's the marketing that will attract new (students or not) that needs to be pitched....
[15:22:08] louis_to that's all
[15:22:35] louis_to for instance, it'd be very cool to announce something like this at OOoCon or even at Oracle Open World
[15:23:12] jsc sure, i will do my best and i am sure that we will have something to announce soon
[15:23:13] louis_to oir at Oscon (July) or even at something similar elsewhere in the world... too late for LinuxTag, alas
[15:23:19] louis_to thanks!!
[15:23:32] louis_to #5....
[15:23:46] louis_to no update....
[15:23:51] louis_to #6...
[15:23:54] * mhu thinks, louis_to is talking about internship, not docu bounties ?
[15:24:04] stx12 actually there is... for #5
[15:24:10] louis_to go ahead.....
[15:24:46] stx12 we stumbled over the budget and cor asked us (mhu, mh and me) to think about a resolution.
[15:25:18] stx12 it was proposed to use some of the money left from last year for the internship. 
[15:26:02] stx12 we think there is a one time opportunity to do that and raise the development budget. 
[15:26:46] stx12 we should avoid the impression that we can do that on a regular basis. but we would like to run the internship every year. 
[15:27:04] louis_to thanks.
[15:27:18] louis_to I'd be hopeful we can obtain a regular source from a corporate angel
[15:27:19] stx12 second there was an amount of 8 slots x 4000 EUR proposed. 
[15:27:42] stx12 at least i understood that we talked about EUR. 
[15:27:59] mhu ...increase the budget, so that docu bounties and internship can be covered this year. ... stx12 is explaining it all ... so I stay silent ...
[15:28:12] stx12 lokking at similar programs this amount seems to high. 
[15:28:17] stx12 too high. 
[15:28:32] louis_to stx12: that was my impression, too, but Cor pointed out the math....
[15:28:41] louis_to ie, 8 X 4K
[15:29:11] stx12 i'm fine with 4k USD or 3.5K EUR (which is even more) 
[15:29:23] jsc me too
[15:29:58] mhu finally, we have not (yet) so much money as Google 
[15:30:08] stx12 so we will clarify the budget with martin (who is the owner) so that we can run the internship and the bounties and have a bit air to breath 
[15:30:31] jsc sounds like a plan
[15:30:44] stx12 an dmartin just send a message that other expenses shouldn't be a blocker. 
[15:31:14] stx12 to me this sounds like we are ready to continue with the internship as planned by cor and friends...
[15:31:48] louis_to yes.
[15:32:19] mhu yes
[15:32:28] jsc yes, should inform Cor about the update ...
[15:32:44] jsc .. i inform ...
[15:32:49] louis_to shall we then update the item ? It seems quite solid and also allows us then to move publicly with this, once we have the other elements
[15:33:25] louis_to that is to say, "What remains for the internship to move forward?"
[15:34:00] jsc update of the related wiki page, i can at least update the money related items
[15:34:08] louis_to thanks
[15:34:20] louis_to and then? I mean, when can we start soliciting for interns, etc.?
[15:34:26] louis_to there are many who could be interested
[15:34:36] stx12 initiate the budget request with martin...
[15:34:48] louis_to and I' dlike to ensure that we work with marketing on this 
[15:35:02] louis_to which i can do, but .... 
[15:35:45] stx12 cor, jsc and mathias b. will takes this i guess.
[15:36:21] louis_to then let's ask them to work with Marketing...
[15:36:25] jsc i have already promoted it or at least the plans in Brazil ;-)
[15:36:35] jsc i will take care of it
[15:37:33] erAck before we market internships, wouldn't we need tasks from the projects first that could be worked on in an internship?
[15:38:17] louis_to yes.
[15:38:37] jsc well, we have the to-do lists and of course people can suggest their own project.
[15:38:43] stx12 that's what i raised last time. the approach was planned a bit different to avoid the blocker. but yes, that helps. 
[15:38:45] louis_to much needs to be refined, first, but we can still Market the idea in general and start engaging the MKT group to expand its boundaries
[15:38:58] erAck ok
[15:39:12] christoph_n The "project proposals" aren't up to date, I think. The wiki page by Cor lists some suggestions how to continue.
[15:39:44] stx12 i think i will call for "task proposals" anyway - if noone objects...
[15:39:58] christoph_n stx12: Very good!
[15:40:10] jsc up to date is relative. Ideas that ae not yet implemented are still open...
[15:40:54] stx12 yes, but not every idea / effort / task / project is in scope for the internship...
[15:41:12] stx12 let's put out a list in parallel to all the todos.
[15:41:18] louis_to I think any new proposal must be negotiated
[15:41:55] louis_to shall we move on to #6?
[15:42:10] stx12 yes
[15:42:25] mhu yes
[15:42:52] jsc yes
[15:43:02] louis_to nothing substantial I can add to agenda items; it has to do with the actual remit of Education project. This will be more feasibly addressed now that the internship program is moving forward, I believe
[15:43:48] louis_to shall we move on to #7?
[15:44:09] christoph_n Mmh, should we then close it? Or just wait...
[15:44:14] stx12 yes, where is sotherncross btw...
[15:44:17] louis_to afaik, no updates, but I do have a really long and interesting email from Sinhala
[15:44:34] christoph_n (Sorry, I meant #6)
[15:44:49] louis_to project lead, and I'll see if I can put that into the newsletter. it pertains to questions related to OOo in Sinhala and other issues
[15:45:17] louis_to but let's move onto post-#7
[15:46:14] louis_to and I confess I doin't see how we can discuss these items here as proposals requriing yes/no votes
[15:46:24] louis_to if anyone wants to add insight here....
[15:46:51] christoph_n Sorry, do we really talk about 2010-04-01#7?
[15:47:32] louis_to my point is : no
[15:47:41] louis_to until they are framed in a way that allows for talk
[15:47:49] louis_to so, I'd like to call to adjourn today's meeting
[15:48:06] louis_to IRC log will be posted shortly; AIs: I ask someone else to update the page?
[15:48:20] christoph_n Sorry, there are some items that are important.
[15:48:25] louis_to and before ending today's, I'd like to ask Eike if he has anytinmng he wants to add...
[15:48:29] mhu can we at least quickly talk about next meetings schedule (last item)
[15:48:31] louis_to oh, okay, go ahead
[15:48:45] louis_to agreed: christoph_n: go ahead
[15:48:58] christoph_n Okay.
[15:49:04] erAck louis_to: I've nothing to add today.
[15:49:11] christoph_n Jumping to 2010-04-29#1: CC Election
[15:49:26] christoph_n Everybody knows the current situation - the proposal is to re-do the election cycle.
[15:49:38] christoph_n First question: Do we agree here?
[15:49:53] christoph_n (for the Product Dev Representative)
[15:50:02] stx12 yes
[15:50:03] erAck yes
[15:50:06] louis_to +1
[15:50:27] mhu +1
[15:50:30] jsc +1
[15:50:32] christoph_n +1
[15:50:40] christoph_n Okay, are there any other seats to be elected (soon)? Can we combine an election?
[15:51:19] louis_to christoph_n: that would be for me, new product dev, and who else? mhu, I believe
[15:51:29] mhu probably
[15:51:44] christoph_n probably ... with a tendency towards ... :-)
[15:52:00] mhu ...1
[15:52:28] christoph_n Okay, are there any reasons to wait a few days/weeks, or should we start as soon as possible?
[15:52:41] christoph_n (I think we can start in a few days.)
[15:52:46] stx12 please remeeber that we can only run 1 election for a constituency at a time. 
[15:52:56] stx12 i don't see a need to wait. 
[15:53:04] mhu we used to have some overlap between old and new members terms ...
[15:53:20] louis_to i would wait until June, so as the new members can learn what is what
[15:53:30] louis_to and this is echoing mhu
[15:53:31] stx12 a few days is ok; but then let's restart the election for the product dev seat. 
[15:53:37] mhu thats what i wanted to say
[15:53:40] christoph_n Ah, so the "5 project leads representatives" are like "product dev seats".
[15:54:15] stx12 no, they are a mixture of prod dev and code contribs
[15:54:45] christoph_n Okay, to be clear: We start the election cycle as soon as possible to find a representative for the product dev. 
[15:54:58] christoph_n mhu and louis_to have to wait ;-)
[15:54:58] stx12 christoph_n: yes
[15:55:06] mhu yes
[15:55:08] louis_to yes, that is desired
[15:55:23] christoph_n Good, then I'll prepare the wiki page to election 2010-05.
[15:55:35] christoph_n Upcoming ...
[15:55:48] stx12 thanks
[15:55:49] christoph_n 2010-04-29#2: Missing OOo desktop presence
[15:56:11] christoph_n I know that it is late, but we already missed the request for the last meeting. Let's - at least - see how to deal with it.
[15:56:32] louis_to christoph_n: my point was and is that it needs to be framed in a way that is actionable
[15:56:34] louis_to it is not now
[15:56:46] louis_to if you wish to frame it that way, go ahead
[15:57:37] christoph_n My question was about how to continue. Is a discussion (soon) on the list appropriate for all?
[15:57:53] mhu yes
[15:58:12] christoph_n At least, we accept this AI since it is a community member request - yes?
[15:58:20] louis_to not necessarily
[15:58:30] louis_to why don't you send it to the list and let us deal with it there?
[15:58:44] louis_to a proper question and proposal must be actionable and must be within our remit
[15:58:46] christoph_n Cor already asked us and nobody (really) replied.
[15:58:55] louis_to we cannot accept those things that are out of our buonds
[15:59:06] stx12 we hear the request and will propose a follow-up activity. 
[15:59:09] louis_to and Cor's acceptance is not the same as our being able to actualluy act on it
[15:59:48] christoph_n stx12: Hear means, to forward it to council-discuss?
[16:00:05] louis_to christoph_n: yes, please
[16:00:27] christoph_n Louis, what would make this item "more actionable"?
[16:00:41] louis_to can we vote ? is it within our remit? 
[16:00:46] stx12 no, it means, we heard / read it. i was going to say that i'm not sure that we will decide / discuss the question, but propose how to proceed.
[16:00:46] louis_to let's see it on the list, please
[16:01:11] louis_to I disagree with stx12 then, as I believe this should be framed in a way that can worked with if at all on the list
[16:01:56] stx12 fine with me; i didn't think of raising proposals now.
[16:02:30] jsc fine for me as well, let's move on the list
[16:02:33] christoph_n I'm lost a bit :-) Louis, then please answer on the (upcoming) request on council-discuss how it can be made "more actionable" and "better framed".
[16:02:45] christoph_n Good. Last item...
[16:02:52] louis_to sure
[16:02:53] christoph_n 2010-04-29#3: CC meetings calendar
[16:03:38] christoph_n I'm more or less fine with the two weeks schedule, but the last 3 times either IRC Log or Meeting Minutes were missing. So if we need more time (or pressure) we should go back to the old schedule.
[16:03:48] christoph_n (last time: both missing)
[16:04:17] stx12 christoph_n: the last log was not linked but at the usual location
[16:04:22] * mhu is fine with the dates as proposed in the calendar (i.e. 3 weeks schedule)
[16:04:35] louis_to me too
[16:04:42] christoph_n (Then I'll link it.)
[16:04:56] stx12 done already
[16:05:03] christoph_n stx12 -- cool!
[16:05:15] christoph_n Eike, Jürgen, Stefan?
[16:05:35] jsc i am not available in 2 weeks -> vacation. And i will check the other dates ... most of them looks fine
[16:05:42] stx12 fine with me; now that i have a stand-in ;-)
[16:05:46] christoph_n ;-)
[16:05:57] christoph_n (So Martin is with us all the time...)
[16:06:21] erAck every 3 weeks is fine, I think.
[16:06:24] christoph_n Eike, you may not agree to each of the items - just state if you are generally fine.
[16:06:26] christoph_n (Oh, thanks)
[16:06:27] stx12 he is on irc but to shy to join ;-)
[16:07:00] christoph_n Okay, anything else?
[16:07:05] * erAck is switching back and forth between browser and irc ...
[16:07:19] jsc i saw, the next meeting is in 3 weeks. It's fine for ;-)
[16:07:41] christoph_n Good. One last question: How to deal with the minutes?
[16:07:55] louis_to by minutes youi mean AIs
[16:07:56] louis_to yes?
[16:07:57] christoph_n I can incorporate the changes for the last items I "moderated"
[16:07:59] louis_to I can do the IRC
[16:08:14] louis_to and I ahd asked for updates to the webpage continaing the agneda with AIs
[16:08:21] louis_to there was no response; you are asking that again
[16:09:00] christoph_n Since we agreed to manage both agenda and work status in one table ...
[16:09:05] louis_to my impression was that we were all responsible for updating our own AIs
[16:09:28] louis_to thereore, it is the responsibiliy of the AI assignee to update the webpage, yes?
[16:09:31] christoph_n Will we do that? The last times it didn't work (well).
[16:09:43] louis_to let's try it again.k
[16:09:52] louis_to rahter than waste time here :-)
[16:09:54] christoph_n We agreed on one person to "finalize" (minor touches) the agenda and copy it to the meeting minutes page.
[16:11:06] christoph_n Waste = neither having a clear agenda nor minutes for the community
[16:11:42] louis_to then I'll finalize it but requre that all with AIs update their relevant sections
[16:11:54] christoph_n Will do that today, I think.
[16:11:54] louis_to and I'll post this IRC to the usual location after meeting ends
[16:13:04] christoph_n If this is okay for everyone, we may close this meeting. Louis, okay?
[16:13:17] louis_to yes, and only indicate if it is NOT okay
[16:13:20] louis_to :-)
[16:13:26] louis_to so all in favour of adjourning the meeting?
Personal tools